The Evangelical Universalist Forum

Able to destroy body and soul

i had to post before i forgot what i was going to say, and sorry but i didn’t get farther than Sherman’s first post :blush:
so sorry if i go over old ground.

alot of good points being raised.

i think Jesus would’ve taken the same route of doctine about death that the Bible talks about in the old testament. Hades was used as the word for Sheol, and David and Solomon both tell us that there is no conscious thought in the grave.
if psuche and soma are used here, but not pneuma…wouldn’t that imply a destruction of the body AND the ability to think, as would normally happen with death, at least according to David and Solomon.

in which case, it’s an odd thing for Christ to say, as any human can take a life, and the dead person would undergo Sheol and not become a conscious being again until the resurrection, where pneuma is reunited with body and soul.

but this doesn’t seem right, as it does seem to be implying that we should not fear humans…we should fear this agent who is able to kill both body and soul…

so basically i am confused. i will read the rest now and possibly edit this!

no, there’s that bit in Chronicles and Kings (i think) where variously God and the satan are given credit for inspiring a census (i think).

i think Paidon makes a good point, though the context seems odd for that.

i think Sherman is correct that it’s not one for doctine. this is a statement that says to me don’t fear man, fear…God? or satan as Gem said? it’s a bit confusing, but there are always going to be things that niggle, no matter what school of thought you embrace.

Fair point Aaron, thanks.

"Consider the following passage from I Peter 1:7, in another translation:
“… in order that the proving of your faith, much more valuable than gold that is being destoyed through fire and being proved , may be found for praise and glory and honour at the revelation of Jesus Christ.”
The order doesn’t sound right, what translation is this?

This rendering sounds incorrect, what translation was this taken from?

I’m not sure why I didn’t answer this before. It could certainly suggest annihilation, but obviously I don’t take it that way. God has a history of destroying and restoring, and as He is the creator of all things in the first place, I don’t see why it should pose a difficulty to suggest that He can do so!


Luke 3:8

God is able to do a lot of things that He doesn’t do. :wink:

This is the Paidionion Translation. :slight_smile:
Yes, it actually is my translation. I studied Greek formally for several years; it is an ongoing study. I was wondering why the “order doesn’t sound right” to you. Perhaps you are comparing it to a translation you use in which the translator has changed the order. Sometimes it necessary to change the word order of the Greek in order to make sense in English. But I didn’t do it with this verse. I retained the same order as the Greek text itself. You can see that this is the case by studying the order in the interlinear below:

ινα------------- το δοκιμιον υμων της-- πιστεως πολυτιμοτερον------- χρυσιου του
in order that the proving–of you the faith---- much more valuable of gold-- of the

απολλυμενου---- δια------πυρος δε-- δοκιμαζομενου ευρεθη---------εις —επαινον και δοξαν
being destroyed through fire----and being proved—may be found for----praise–and glory

και τιμην— εν αποκαλυψει ιησου— χριστου
and honour in–revelation—of Jesus Christ