Canonized Saint sees Martin Luther in Hell


#1

I honestly don’t know what to make if Catholicism (ironically “Catholic” literally means “Universal”), but I know they are big on those they consider Saints especially claims of miracles and visions.

What concerns me here is the claim that their canonized Saint Padre Pio saw Martin Luther in Hell being tormented in a vision. You can call
me something of a church hopper but I’m trying to understand and learn as muchas I can, but I want to know your take on the matter.

Link to claim down below.

tradcatknight.blogspot.ca/2016/1 … n.html?m=1

I’d appreciate the help, especially if they’re are experts on Catholicism and/or Lutherism here.


Take on this vision from a theological perspective ?
#2

I go along with the saints and mystics visions. Pio had the stgmata so his vision is very, very, very, very likely to be true.


#3

Nope, I don’t buy it, nor any other ‘vision of hell’ story told by a nonbinlical author. Our religious beliefs should be based on what the Bible says and metaphysics, not unverifiable claims.


#4

And the Thomist metaphysics of Thomas Aquinas is reality and the Bible confirmed by Pio.


#5

Should it be noted that there is no record on what Padre said on Luther besides this statment which is what another guy says that Padre said ?


#6

Yes. If he had the vision it was most likely true though. Pio had the stigmata and the RCC is based on Thomist metaphysics. St. Teresa of Avila had a vision of hell she wrote about and she said our words can’t capture the reality. This is why the Bible uses metaphor to describe it. The realities of heaven and hell are much greater than the symbols convey.


#7

Here’s an answer from a Catholic source.

thesplendorofthechurch.com/2017/ … rk-castor/


#8

Very true. Catholics consider Protestants and Orthodox brothers and sisters in Christ. They are just separate bodies.


#9

That is after second Vatican right ?


#10

Well they have made statements that seem to exclude all outside the church but they have clarified what they mean by them to categorize them as brothers and sisters. They are just a separate body.


#11

#12

Visions can have many meanings. That’s what I have learned, from the Lakota, Ute and Ojibwe tribal, medicine men and women.


#13

In any case I lean to doubt on the vision, at least by Catholic standards considering Pio himself doesn’t verify the vision.


#14

If Pio didn’t claim to have the vision then I wouldn’t believe it.


#15

Well considering that this claim comes from a man who claimed to know Pio decades after his death, these claims are murky. As in there’s no actual evidence he had the vision beyond what other people say.


#16

Are you Catholic? I was raised Catholic but ‘saw the light’ and left that dogma behind years ago and never looked back.

It’s prudent to exercise skepticism when someone claims something supernatural. You may want to Google ‘padre pio fraud’.


#17

I did look up the fruad, to many people arguing for and against it. Pio has got to be the most muddled up figures I have come come across in my Religous studies. I did judge the vision by Catholic standards, because as you can see, I am talking to a Catholic. I’m trying to get all sides of the argument from an actual theological perspective.


#18

I think Pio Padre was real. But his visions - were subject to interpretation. And BOTH the RC and EO churches, investigate any miracle healings. Both during their lifetime and after their death. And the RC and EO physicians - do their due diligence. Where I differ, is that saints and healers - are present outside the RC and EO churches. And can be found in Eastern, Sufi and Native American gathers. But they normally don’t advertise, sell tickets or charge money. They are like the A-Team. They will help you, if you know how to find them.


#19

Wow. I wasn’t aware of this. Thanks.


#20

Are YOU Catholic?

Like I said, exercise scrutiny. Don’t take things at face value.

mcgill.ca/newsroom/channels … ill-212134

And his marks weren’t even where Jesus was nailed. Romans crucified people by their wrists, not their hands.