The Evangelical Universalist Forum

Chad Holtz: Repented back to Hell

Evangelical Universalism
#1

Some of you may remember the name Chad Holtz- the pastor who was fired after Rob Bell’s book release for also questioning hell.

here is a thread from back then.

Chad struggled with a sex addiciton and went to a place called Pure Life Ministries in Kentucky to go through rehab counseling for months on end. It was a last ditch effort to save his marriage. He recently got out, deleted his website and started a new blog:
chadholtznew.wordpress.com

here is his post::::::

I Repent Jun
1
Below is the testimony I read at my graduation from Pure Life Ministries on May 29th, 2012. I am sharing it for 2 reasons. One, I believe there are plenty of people hurting like my wife and I have been hurting for years. My prayer is that this would give them hope and point them to the only true recovery – Jesus. Two, given the public nature of my past, from being dismissed from the church I pastored for disbelieving in hell to coming out as a sex addict, I felt it necesssary to be public about the change God has mercifully worked in my life. To Him be all the glory.

So before my testimony, I need to say this:

**I repent of my past denial of hell or that a person could ever be eternally seperated from a holy God. I know now that I had no fear of God. Therefore, I had no knowledge of God (Prov. 1:7). I was a fool with an MDiv. **

**Marrow’s Chapel United Methodist Church was right to ask me to leave. It was mercy. ** I am so sorry for the pain I caused them through that entire ordeal last year and I ask their forgiveness. I have wept many tears over the last many months, pleading with God that no one would be lost for my prideful and blind confident assertions (1 Tim. 1:7). Love doesn’t win. God wins. And it is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of a holy, living God (Heb. 10.31). I lost sight of this and God, in His mercy, granted me a chance to repent.

My old blog will be deleted this weekend (and this one was only created for the purpose of this post). Like Paul, I count pretty much everything I said and did in the past as dross (Phil. 3:8) compared to the intimacy I now have with Jesus. I realize now that much if not all of what I did in the past was from a place of pride. A love of self more than God and a desire to build my own kingdom (blog readers, facebook friends, amens) rather than God’s Kingdom. God resists the proud, and I was most certainly being resisted. I still have a long ways to go, but with God, all things are possible and I am cofident that the good work He has begun He will bring to completion.

This is my testimony. I pray it blesses you and yours.

Psalm 119:71 It is good for me that I was afflicted, that I might learn your statutes.

I wasn’t feeling that the night of July 7, 2011, when my wife told me we were finished for good after discovering evidence of yet another adulterous affair. A 20 year addiction to pornography, chat rooms and illicit phone calls led finally to this. Amy, a shell of the woman I married 8 years before had had enough. A month later I received divorce papers and a month after that I was sitting in divorce court, contemplating ending it all.

My addiction and adultery all took place while serving as a pastor and going through seminary. I knew a lot about God but did not know God. I had no fear of God, denying that such a loving God could ever send a soul to hell. But if there was ever a person to whom our Lord would say, “Depart from me, I never knew you,” it was most surely I.

I arrived at Pure Life Ministries on Nov. 3, 2011 for no other reason than wanting to escape my misery. Any place had to be better than the roach motel that had become my home for months. I told my friend who dropped me off that my highest hope for my stay here was that I would come away with at least 7 months sobriety under my belt – more than I had ever had in my adult life. Of course, “sobriety” at that time was a very low bar: no pornoagraphy or affairs. The idea that I could be free from lustful thoughts, fantasies or self-gratification not only seemed impossible but hilarious.

But God had so much more in store for me than sobriety. The person leading the Mercy Studies 3 days after my arrival said something that went into me. He said,

It is not God’s desire for me to be better, but new.

I so desperately wanted to be new! I was certain that either God would show Himself to be real to me here or my life was over.

One of several breakthroughs for me happened in late December when we were challenged to take seriously Charles Finney’s “Breaking Up the Fallow Ground” reading. I pressed in, and spent all of Wednesday writing out the many ways I have neglected God and sinned against He and others. I found myself prostrate, here in the chapel, crying out to God, undone by my own wickedness. I saw the cross fore the first time as it truly is and wondered why on earth God would do that for such a wretch like me. I saw the price that Jesus paid not just for the world, but for Chad Holtz. And it cut me to the core.

As I repented I cried out to God for my wife, Amy. Her despair over our marriage and the 8 years of hurt I put her through left her clinically depressed, filled with anxiety and faithless. Watching her husband preach from the pulpit each week while being the only one who really knew me made her sick, and she told me one day that if God existed at all He never would have let her marry a monster like me. I pleaded with God to take from her all her pain and depression and unbelief and to cast it onto me. I deserve it all! I cried. Lord, if you do nothing else for me in this life let me bear her suffering! And in that moment Jesus whispered to me, “I already bore it.”

Jesus has done far more abundantly than I could think or imagine in this place. He saved me. I know today that I am free, redeemed, delivered, unchained. I know what it means to live at the cross and to walk in daily repentance. I know what it is to fear God and the joy of holiness. By God’s grace, what I thought 7 months ago was impossible and hilarious is now my testimony. That chains that bound me for decades are gone. The blood of Jesus has washed me clean! Hallelujah!

God has even seen fit to restore my dead marriage. He not only saved me, God saved Amy as well. Days of depression and anxiety are gone and her strength and joy is found in the Lord. In March she wrote me in only of her many letters to me:

I used to get so angry at women who said that one day I would look back on all of this and be grateful. But crazy as it may sound, I am so thankful for our many afflictions, Chad, because through them I have been brought closer to Christ.

Amy, through her faithful prayers with our kids, even led my daughter Sophie and son Maddox to accepting Jesus into their young hearts. My 5 beautiful kids are blossoming where 7 months ago there was only despair, fear and sadness.

I want to thank all the staff here for faithfully pointing me to Jesus. Thank you, Brother Ken. Because of your willingness to be less so that He can be more, I know that I am not leaving here dependent upon a counselor or a program but needy of Christ and His Word. I will also miss all of you guys who have become a second family to me. Thank you to my 5 wonderful children for helping mama out and for never giving up on your dad. I love you so much! And Brody, your prayer for a “real family” is answered. Amy, thank you for taking a risk and making that phone call that saved my life – you know the one. I love you and can’t wait to honor and cherish you all the days the Lord gives me. And finally, thank you Lord Jesus, for afflicting me so mercifully. I am eternally your servant.

epilogue:

I also want to thank all those friends out there (you know who you are) for your prayers, letters, support and financial help towards Amy and the kids during my time away. You are such a blessing! We are so grateful!

Chad and Amy can be reached at amy.holtz@yahoo.com

::::::
as someone who looked up to Chad it stings for him to imply that anyone holding a non eternal hell position would be a fool with no fear or knowledge of God…

any thoughts?

Lost fear of hell?
#2

It’s really hard to take seriously his new rhetoric about not having feared God before, God wins, etc. He’d never heard those lines before? It’s almost like he wants to distance himself from his previous life, for good reason, so much so that he’s not distinguishing between what was good and what was bad. Also, if he wants back in with his wife, family, a church maybe it’s in his best interest to deny his previous beliefs on hell?

#3

I praise God he’s stopped being extremely unloving to his wife & church, however it’s tragic & ironic he now feels he needs to reject the importance of love & in fact needs to be unloving by calling Universalists fools :confused: :frowning:

#4

Seems like a clear case of pitching to get his old job back.

“I pleaded with God to take from her all her pain and depression and unbelief and to cast it onto me. I deserve it all! I cried.” Yeah right.

Shame the “merciful” God who gave the errant pastor a chance to repent (and avoid the big E from his poor wife) won’t be doing the same for all those wicked unbelievers - many of whom doubtless never cheated on their wives or husbands, and weren’t “sex addicts”, but never mind. To hell with them.

What next, I wonder? “Sorry I raped your daughter, guv. I couldn’t help it, I’m a rape addict.”

P-lease!

#5

Like a dog returning to its vomit. Like Israel in the wilderness crying to return to the bondage of Israel. The loss, and the fear of loss that comes with speaking the truth against the despicable doctrine of demons is great. I talk big, yet here I am as a partially undercover UR. I don’t deny it, but I don’t stand on a corner with a soap box either. Though thats never been my style. I understand the desire to go back to safe, churchianity. Be a good little boy and reap the rewards. But then I’d be vomited out of Gods mouth, and I’d rather not.

Being in lockstep with american evangelicism is like being in a union, or the mob. You receive great protection. You receive great perks. When someone asks where you go to church and you tell them_________, they can say “oh he’s one of the good guys”. He’s not one of those crazy sad souls. You’re “in”. If you own a business you get people coming to you because you’re part of the club. If you need a job you get bumped up because you’re a good christian. You get to keep your friends because they can hang out with you without being led astray by your heretical views. Never mind dining with hookers and tax collectors, this is the in club, you wouldn’t want to sully your ears with those sinners.

Its very difficult indeed to be on the outside. Many prisoners who have been in for so many years want to go back because they know no other life.

disclamer
This statement has not been directed against all people who go to church, any denomination, any clergy etc. etc. There are many great people in churches and in american evangelicism, especially the members here. This is just my experience and limited view of the small chunk of america I’ve experienced.

#6

Does this guy blame UR for his adultery? As if he could just do what he wanted because there was no eternal Hell? Wow. His problem was not, not believing in Hell. His problem was not believing in GRACE. Once Hell is dispelled, obviously not living under it’s threat is a hard transition to make…BUT we DO see who we REALLY are. What’s really in our hearts that we bury because of fear of Hell. Is it not better to face these things? Once I was willing to do that, their power over me was broken.

I do hope what this guy has is real, but…Fear is not of God…It really cannot change a heart.

#7

in what context did he say that ? it’s unforntunately true that a percentage of universalists are foolish but I remember friending him ages ago and listening to the silliest of statements ! :wink:

#8

::::::
as someone who looked up to Chad it stings for him to imply that anyone holding a non eternal hell position would be a fool with no fear or knowledge of God…

any thoughts?

in some ways I fear GOD more now than before, but I am also free from the ludicrious fear that that kind of GOD binds you too !

#9

Having come to believe in UR I too have a greater fear of God. I’ve come to believe that how I live is much more important than just what I profess to believe.

#10

Chad Holz wrote:

I read this and I am dumbfounded by the doublespeak. Love doesn’t win, but God does? Believing that God’s stated will for His entire creation… that it be reconciled and restored to Him in Jesus Christ… shall come to pass is something from which a person must turn and repent? Good grief. :cry:

I praise God that this guy’s family apparently is being restored. That is awesome. And I pray that the freedom from his addictions is permanent.

But I cannot help but think something fishy is afoot here, and I doubt it has much, if anything, to do with a belief in ECT.

#11

thanks for the responses ladies and gents.

i guess my question is do you guys ever fear that God will do this to you?

I struggle pretty hardcore with spiritual guilt for my slow but large changes in theology. It seems like I am constantly second guessing myself, and feel very guilty. When i see something like this from chad, I wonder if I am spitting in Gods face all along.

anyone ever experienced this if you have transitioned from ECT/fundamentalism?

#12

Hi Andrew. Yes, I still struggle with UR…But, I struggled with ECT too!!! And, a person who believes in ECT is also constantly worrying about spitting in God’s Face!! :wink:

#13

Sigh. It’s great that he and his family have finally been delivered from all this; but as others have pointed out, his problem was clearly not a lack of belief in ECT; it was (in part) due to hypocrisy. I have heard many stories exactly like this (apart from the universalism-blaming) from people who have always believed in ECT, both before and after their deliverance from whatever hardcore sin affliction they struggled with. At the very least, I think he’s throwing the baby out with the bath water here.

P.S. It sounds to me like he was actually in ‘hell’, and was delivered from it. But that’s our God for you…

#14

Now, this is somthing interesting forMr. Holtz to ponder. The ones like myelf who have studied addiction counseling Android sexual education, wth a specialty in sexual addiction do know that one of the key persons in the sexual addiction community, ROY K. founder of Sexaholics Annonymous was Android avid reader of George Macdonald, Android sugested some of his sponsees to read him. Even quotes him in the SA White Book. He was,probably a believer of UR.

#15

CORRECTION:
I am new to my Tablet, so I made a mistake in my last post. I have specializd in addiction AND sexual education. There is in such a thing as Android sexual education… yet… Maybe in the year 2999, if everythin becomes computerized, it may.
In a more serious tone, if you turn to p. 171 of Roy K’s SA White Book, you will find a very long quote from George Macdonald.

#16

[ADMIN NOTE: someone with a different account calling him or herself “write-ups” has [url=http://www.evangelicaluniversalist.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=3221&p=46867#p46810]posted a comment from the same IP address as this member.]

[CGUNHOUSE NOTE: You can have thousands of PC behind a proxy server, they all appear to be the same IP to the outside world. That is the point of a proxy server, one point of contact on the internet, one point you have to defend against hacker attack. I am not “write-ups” so this is just a very poor attempt to discredit the me and “write-ups”.]

Chad Holtz’s repentance is sincere; when I read about his repentance I felt the joy of the Lord! I would say that I now understand the following verse:

I tell you that in the same way there will be more rejoicing in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine righteous persons who do not need to repent. (Luk 15:7)

.andrew.:

Chad’s statement:

I repent of my past denial of hell or that a person could ever be eternally seperated from a holy God. I know now that I had no fear of God. Therefore, I had no knowledge of God (Prov. 1:7). I was a fool with an MDiv.

I understand Chad when he made this statement. The fear of the Lord drives people to His Word, because they know the power of life and death lie in the words of the Bible. Without this fear, those same words become no more than ink spots on a page and their wisdom and instruction become lost in the world and in the flesh. So in reference to your (.andrew.) original statement “that anyone holding a non eternal hell position would be a fool with no fear or knowledge of God,” has less to do about Chad’s position on hell as it does with his past self confessed lack of fear in God.

Amy:

I see a man seeking restoration and not selfish gain; I do not see a man looking for the things you mention. I see a man seeking to restore relationship with his family, his friends, his church and especially his God.

Alex Smith:

I think that you are referring to Chad’s Statement, “Love doesn’t win. God wins,” if I am wrong forgive me. I do not think that Chad was implying not to be loving, but I think it was a reference to Rob Bell’s book, “Love Wins”. For myself, I would like to add there is more to God than just love. Let’s look at John 3:16:

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son” (love)
“that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.” (truth)

Some Christians believe that you can love people into heaven, but really it is not love that sets one free, but the truth.

And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free. (Joh 8:32)

As for the “Universalists fools,” those are your words not Chad’s. Chad’s reference to being a fool was in reference to his past lack of fear of God.

Johnnyparker:

I suggest that you read 2 Corinthians 2.

sass:

Could you please explain “I do hope what this guy has is real, but…Fear is not of God…It really cannot change a heart," in context of Proverbs 1:7 (used by Chad)?

Andy:

Read my comment to Alex Smith.

.andrew. and sass:

When God looks at a Christian, He see the Blood of Christ, He doesn’t see the sinner. So if we feel separated from God in any way or worried about our status with God, it is because we have drawn away from Him and not Him from us. I suggest that you read “A Normal Christian Life” by Watchman Nee; this book helped me in terms of the Blood of Christ and the relationship of the Blood to God, man and satan.

#17

Maybe it is sincere, but it’s human nature to overreact and throw the baby out with the bathwater. God knows I’ve done this type of thing myself more than once.
Chad is still connecting his lack of fear of God with an unbiblical notion of an endless hell, a connection that exists in his mind only.
In other words, one does not have to believe in an endless hell to fear God.

#18

[ADMIN NOTE: someone with a different account calling him or herself “cgunhouse” has posted other comments in this thread from the same IP address as this member.]

True Repentance

The fullness of the revelation of the love of God for us only comes with the knowledge and revelation of what we have been saved from. It is not just the heavy weight of our own sin, but the consequences of it - the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life (Romans 6:23). If we have not yet experienced the depth of our own sin and the price that was paid for our redemption, then has true repentance occurred in our life? David fell on his face when he realized what he had done - “Against you, you only, have I sinned and done what is evil in your sight” (Psalms 51:4). Job (a righteous man) fell on his face when he recognized how errant he’d been about his knowledge of God. Paul gloried in the cross because this is where he recognized his own depravity, and his complete inability to save himself.

True repentance gives us a crystal clear vision of our own depravity and God’s great mercy. No one deserves this kind of mercy. Presumptuous, to say the least, to think we can write our own rules as go along and that God will change to suit us. The fact of who He is is enough to drive a healthy fear into us, and a reverence to submit ourselves wholly to Him. We do not decide what is just and what is not. God is HOLY AWESOME JUST MERCIFUL, etc. etc. He is all that His Word says He is, not what we think He should be.

I believe that Chad has had this revelation of sin/consequence that comes with true repentance, hence the title of his blog, “Unchained.”

#19

WU,

That could still very well be true (and I hope it is) without Chad having to throw Christian universalism under the bus wholesale.

After all, we don’t get to say what God is not either, such as not merciful, not interested in saving some persons from sin, or not persistent at saving some persons from sin.

Or rather, everyone gets to discover God and so to say, to the best of their ability to learn and understand, what God is and isn’t and what God does and doesn’t do. :slight_smile: Non-universalists aren’t the only ones who have the privilege. The salient question is whether one or another kind of non-universalism is factually correct, or whether one or another kind of universalism is.

(If one or another kind of non-universalism is factually correct, then in fact we do get to say what God is and is not and what God does and does not do. Otherwise we aren’t evangelizing correctly. If one or another kind of universalism is factually correct, then in fact we get to say what God is and is not and what God does and does not do–but with at least slightly different details. Otherwise we aren’t evangelizing correctly. “Orthodoxy” is about rightly representing God. That’s what “ortho-doxy” means: right representation, including in properly praising God, worshiping in truth.)

Chad went with a very morally loose kind of Christian universalism that wasn’t primarily (or maybe even at all) interested in sinners being saved from their sins, but rather in sinners being saved from punishment. He wanted to keep on doing what he was doing without a threat of being punished for it sooner or later if he persisted at it. He got burned for doing so, and yay for that (so far as it goes). It would have been better for him to stick with some kind of non-universalism, even if some kind of Christian universalism is true, and take his sin damned seriously enough to cooperate with God in stopping it now.

If being scared of hopeless punishment is the only way he can bring himself to man up and do what is right, then let him be scared of it! Better that he should imply all Christian universalists are fools (wrong though he is), than that he should do injustice to his wife. :angry:

But better still for him to come to believe God persists in acting to save all sinners from sin until God gets that fully accomplished for everyone, if that’s true, and to cooperate with God in that–first and foremost in regard to himself and his own sins now.

(Obviously if that isn’t true, then better for him to not come to believe it, or to come to disbelieve it asap, although God might still make some good use of his belief in it to lead him and others to be more righteous until then. I don’t want to presume to limit what God can accomplish even through human error–except insofar that, logically, the One Who is Truth won’t leave people in error but leads them to truth. :slight_smile: God cannot finally accomplish that while the person remains in error of course, so that’s a clear limitation of what God can accomplish even through human error.)

Anyway, back when my brother first brought Chad to my attention last year (shortly after Rob Bell’s book was released), I opined to him at the time that he sounded like someone whom his church ought to have swiftly fired anyway. I’m sad to hear I was even more right about that than I realized, but not particularly surprised: in my experience the people who rhapsodize about being free from fear of punishment, while not talking about repentance and being freed from their sins, while also dissing people as oppressive and evil for warning about punishment for sin, tend to have sins that they want to keep doing that they don’t want to be punished for. Not everyone who does that fits the whole profile (although I don’t think they should do that in any case), but I sure wouldn’t bet ahead of verification against an example not fitting the rest of the profile.

In short: if Chad is scared of punishment now, great, he should be!–more righteousness to him, and more justice for his wife and friends and family (I hope, although fear of punishment doesn’t always lead to that either). If he needs a fear of hopeless punishment to scare him into doing the right thing, let it be so. The technical truth of the issues at stake remains unaffected, regardless of what he himself needs to convince him to work with God in doing right by other people. (Certainly people can fear God and do righteousness without fearing hopeless punishment. Although apparently not Chad. Yet.)

#20

Having been pretty harsh there, I will add that we should be careful not to speculate or comment about Chad’s heart or motives, beyond what can be contextually inferred from what he himself wrote about his heart and motives previously in his extensive post at the new blog site.

Worth comparing, though: his two articles from last year after Rob’s book was released (or was pre-released to be more precise), which picked up some discussion here at the forum (though not from me). I thought I was very nice briefly wishing him luck trying to get a new church position here in Tennessee, even though I worried privately offsite at the time that he had gone too far in giving up a fear of God, and would eventually drag Christian universalism through the mud as a result.

Sadly, the problem was very much worse than that: a wife’s broken heart is unspeakably worse than aspersion cast on a movement based on maximal hope of salvation from sin in Christ. I would rather Chad lump us all together with his own professed attitudes about how he was a Christian universalist (according to what he himself said his attitudes were in his repentance-post reported at the top of the thread) when he goes back to believing in hopeless punishment, if that helps him be loyal and righteous and truly loving to his wife.

But he never got those attitudes toward God that he now (quite properly) derides having held when he was a Christian universalist, from any Christian universalist who fears God.

And there are plenty of Christian universalists who fear the Holy God Who has revealed Himself to us in His Word.

Whether any kind of Christian universalism is true or not is one thing. But Christian universalism wasn’t his problem; he brought his problems into it.

It isn’t the fault of Christian universalism (except of a very morally irresponsible kind) that he lost the fear of God that leads people to repent of their sins when they won’t listen to peaceful correction from God. And it was definitely not the fault of Christian universalism that he continued to love his sin more than he loved Jesus. If he used CU as a way to continue loving his sin rather than to cooperate in righteousness with God, he sure as hell didn’t get that from any purgatorial Christian universalist. (And not from most of the ultra-universalists who also frequent this forum either.)

That having been said, I hope and trust his repentance was and is sincere–I have less than no reason to believe otherwise at this time; and I have no reason to believe that he’s only saying what he thinks his church and family want him to say (but secretly still believes some kind of Christian universalism to be true) in order to get back into their good graces.

God grant him and all of us a loving fear, whenever we will not cooperate with Love Himself without fear!

And God grant him and all of us a day to come when, our love perfected, we can cast aside fear of {kolasis}.

But let nothing less than perfect Love having remade us new in perfect love, so that at last we perfectly love, cast out our fear until then!