The Evangelical Universalist Forum

Is everything fun a sin? 1 John 2:15-17

Practices Christian Living
#101

It is indeed the standard evangelical assumption that the LoF speaks to the afterlife” but an alternative perspective is to view this as the temporal judgement in the here and now of AD70… where for many life quite literally ended in the DoJ — or even metaphorically speaking including those taken captive in deportation to Rome, never again to know the presence of God associated with the Temple; EXILE was DEATH and this with NO promised resurrection as per Babylon… thus this was the SECOND and final demise of OC Israel.

“Whoever loves OR practices a lie” in the biblical context was relative life under the old covenant mode of existence, out of which many a NC believer had initially come… and then, to their peril, a goodly number were returning.

Col 3:9 Do not lie to one another, since you have put off the old man (the OC) with his deeds,…

1Tim 4:1-3 Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times (of the OC) some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons, speaking lies in hypocrisy, having their own conscience seared with a hot iron, forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from foods which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth.

These were the Judaisers and a blight on the early church… one half of two main concerns Paul, for example, confronts in his epistles.

#102

I subscribe to the standard view on the lake of fire, because it better fits my understanding of the Scriptures.

Rev. 21:8
But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars —they will be consigned to the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.”

1 Cor. 6:11
And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

I believe that the lake of fire is yet future. One day, both death and Hades (which I believe to be a postmortem camp for POWs who died while still captive to Satan) will be cast into the lake of fire (Rev. 20:14). But I believe the lake of fire is temporal, representing God’s consuming fire of love. That love is remedial, and will burn away people’s cords of bondage to a false identity while there, in order to prepare them for eternity with Him.

Christians, on the other hand, have already received the free, permanent, Gift of Righteousness (Rom. 5:17)—their new identity in Christ; and so, no longer being captive to the devil at physical death, they go up to the New Jerusalem, which is currently located somewhere “above” —but which will some day come “down” to a new earth:

I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God….
Rev. 21:2.

Note: when a Christian lies, he is going against his true identity in Christ—because he is no longer now, by nature, a liar; and so when he dies, he will not “be consigned to the fiery lake of burning sulfur…the second death.” [Similarly, when a caterpillar becomes a butterfly, while he may yet occasionally land on a dungheap instead of a flower, he does not return to being a caterpillar (“sinner”) because of his poor choices as a butterfly.]

#103

Nice to run across this!

" I encourage those who smoke to light a cigar in solitude or with a band of brothers. Recite a poem out loud or in the confines of your soul. Rejoice, reflect, and ponder over the mystery of our faith in Jesus Christ."

"

What is a cigar to a man
if not a sacred companion?
Never fails to calm the soul,
always ready to endure the human toll.

A weapon of choice in turbulent times,
since the era of the ships of the line;
tried and tested in fields of war,
the perfect medicine to numb the sight of human gore.

The smoke it produces – a sweet fragrance,
similar to that of the finest incense;
not too strong, nor too weak
allows the mind to reach its intellectual peak.

When smoked in the presence of other men,
a spirit of brotherhood is kindled amongst fellow brethren.
No finer way to spend one’s leisure
the source of man’s greatest pleasure."

#104

You’re blessed if your wife agrees with that.

#105

image

#106

I am blessed. She does.

#107

Just don’t hang around Moe, when you smoke a cigar. :crazy_face:

While I don’t smoke (tobacco nor anything else), Frankenstein loved a good cigar. :crazy_face:

#108

C’mon Randy - you’ve teased us about peyote and other mushrooms and peace pipes for years. Never??

#109

I’ll give you my standard CIA answer. I can neither confirm nor deny, whether I have ever participated in Ayahuasca or Peyote ceremonies. Nor can I neither confirm nor deny, whether I have ever partaken of such medicines. But I can confirm I was part of the extended family, of the Two Feathers Medicine Clan. Until it disbanded, upon the death of the spiritual leader. And they did hold Peyote and Ayahuasca ceremonies.

Having said that, there is a lot of research…regarding medical and therapeutic benefits. See, for example, M.D. and Ph.D. researchers - studying the subject matter. See Dr. Joe Tafur Explains Peyote and Ayahuasca, The Future of Psychedelic-Assisted Psychotherapy , and Psilocybin Sessions: Psychedelics could help people with addiction and anxiety.

Also look at the Christian crossovers, as practiced by the Native American Church. See What Should Christians Take from the Native American Church Peyote Ceremony?. Or listen to this Christian peyote song.

The bottom line is that Native Americans who use Peyote and /or Ayahuasca in a ceremony, don’t do it for recreational purposes. They look at it as a sacrament (like Catholics and Eastern Orthodox, view communion) and medicine (akin to how medical doctors view medicine).

As far as pipes are concerned, I have participated in pipe prayer ceremonies. In some cases, they used tobacco. In other cases, it was red willow bark.

#110

I believe the correct thing to say would be: I WILL neither confirm nor deny… :slight_smile:

#111

Well, Mission Impossible says it similar to how I do. :crazy_face:

#112

You win!!

1 Like
#113

Speaking of pipes can you come up with a clip with my favorite TV character , Sherlock Holmes played by Basil Rathbone?

#114

I’ll let Randy find that, but note that I bought that same pipe about 30 years ago. It’s a great pipe. I wish I had the hat to go with it :slight_smile:

#115

Actually, Dave and Steve - one can find the full movies on YouTube. Just type in the keywords into Google: “sherlock holmes basil Rathbone youtube”. But I’ll share one of Mr. Data, playing the character. :crazy_face:

#116

I am blessed to have never smoked in my life!

1 Like
#117

Perhaps, perhaps not. I won’t judge you.

#118

To be free from the consequences of smoking, such as emphysema,lung cancer, a stinky breath, etc. is indeed a blessed condition.

I don’t consider smoking to be a source of “fun”.