The Evangelical Universalist Forum

Is everything fun a sin? 1 John 2:15-17


It is indeed the standard evangelical assumption that the LoF speaks to the afterlife” but an alternative perspective is to view this as the temporal judgement in the here and now of AD70… where for many life quite literally ended in the DoJ — or even metaphorically speaking including those taken captive in deportation to Rome, never again to know the presence of God associated with the Temple; EXILE was DEATH and this with NO promised resurrection as per Babylon… thus this was the SECOND and final demise of OC Israel.

Whoever loves OR practices a liein the biblical context was relative life under the old covenant mode of existence, out of which many a NC believer had initially come… and then, to their peril, a goodly number were returning.

Col 3:9 Do not lie to one another, since you have put off the old man (the OC) with his deeds,…

1Tim 4:1-3 Now the Spirit expressly says that in latter times (of the OC) some will depart from the faith, giving heed to deceiving spirits and doctrines of demons, speaking lies in hypocrisy, having their own conscience seared with a hot iron, forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from foods which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth.

These were the Judaisers and a blight on the early church… one half of two main concerns Paul, for example, confronts in his epistles.


I subscribe to the standard view on the lake of fire, because it better fits my understanding of the Scriptures.

Rev. 21:8
But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars —they will be consigned to the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.”

1 Cor. 6:11
And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

I believe that the lake of fire is yet future. One day, both death and Hades (which I believe to be a postmortem camp for POWs who died while still captive to Satan) will be cast into the lake of fire (Rev. 20:14). But I believe the lake of fire is temporal, representing God’s consuming fire of love. That love is remedial, and will burn away people’s cords of bondage to a false identity while there, in order to prepare them for eternity with Him.

Christians, on the other hand, have already received the free, permanent, Gift of Righteousness (Rom. 5:17)—their new identity in Christ; and so, no longer being captive to the devil at physical death, they go up to the New Jerusalem, which is currently located somewhere “above” —but which will some day come “down” to a new earth:

I saw the Holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God….
Rev. 21:2.

Note: when a Christian lies, he is going against his true identity in Christ—because he is no longer now, by nature, a liar; and so when he dies, he will not “be consigned to the fiery lake of burning sulfur…the second death.” [Similarly, when a caterpillar becomes a butterfly, while he may yet occasionally land on a dungheap instead of a flower, he does not return to being a caterpillar (“sinner”) because of his poor choices as a butterfly.]