Opposers of christian universalism refuted

[rodgertutt]

OPPOSERS OF CHRISTIAN UNIVERSALISM REFUTED
If necessary, copy and paste the links into your browser.

COMMON ARGUMENTS ADDRESSED
Good news of God’s love for all mankind - find it here at Tentmaker
tentmaker.org/FAQ/index.html
and
Quick Find: Links to Information on Hell and Universal Salvation
tentmaker.org/bloglinks.htm

CONSEQUENSES OF ETERNAL TORMENT THEOLOGY
tentmaker.org/articles/hells_fruit.html

BIBLE THREATENINGS EXPLAINED
tentmaker.org/books/BibleThr … ained.html

THE SCHOLARS CORNER THE CENTER FOR BIBLE STUDIES IN CHRISTIAN UNIVERSALISM
tentmaker.org/ScholarsCorner.html

UNIVERSAL SALVATION UNIVERSITY
richardwaynegarganta.com/universalsalvation.htm

RESPONSES TO CURRENT CHAMPIONS OF ETERNAL TORMENT THEOLOGY

Don Hewey
gtft.org/Library/condon/Question … nswers.htm
saviourofall.org/opposers/HeweyOnAion.html
saviourofall.org/opposers/He … leOne.html
saviourofall.org/opposers/He … leTwo.html
saviourofall.org/opposers/He … Three.html

Eric Landstrom
saviourofall.org/opposers/Landstrom.html
saviourofall.org/opposers/Landstrom2.html
saviourofall.org/opposers/Er … fAion.html
savior-of-all.com:80/aionian.html

Matt Slick
tentmaker.org/articles/matt_ … etalk.html
saviourofall.org/opposers/Exposing.html
scaredofhell.com/CARMmattslickun … uttal.html
indefenceofthecross.blogspot.com … alism.html
city-data.com/forum/christia … slick.html

Tom Logan
saviourofall.org/opposers/To … r1528.html

Hal Lindsey
purposeoflife.org.uk/reply.htm

Dwane
saviourofall.org/opposers/EonLimitGod.html

W. E. Vine
saviourofall.org/poisonfruitofvine.html

A great fifteen chapter introductory series to ultimate reconciliation.
J. Preston Eby does a thorough job covering many aspects of the topic.
Fundamental reading for any person interested in studying universalism from a solid Biblical perspective.
Highly Recommended!
THE SAVIOR OF THE WORLD SERIES EBY
godfire.net/eby/saviour_of_the_world.html

[JasonPratt]

A handy list of links, Roger; thanks!

(Um, “Dwayne”…? He doesn’t seem very famous as a “champion”… )

[Melchizedek]

I lol’ed at the listing of “Dwane”. I must confess I’ve never heard of him…

Interestingly, Martin Zender, who clearly believes in the ultimate salvation of all does not consider himself a “universalist”, given his definition of universalism, which is that a universalist is “someone who believes God will let everyone into heaven simply because He’s a nice guy”. Or something to that effect…

[SLJ]

I lol’ed at the listing of “Dwane”. I must confess I’ve never heard of him…

Interestingly, Martin Zender, who clearly believes in the ultimate salvation of all does not consider himself a “universalist”, given his definition of universalism, which is that a universalist is “someone who believes God will let everyone into heaven simply because He’s a nice guy”. Or something to that effect…

That is what most people think of when they hear the word ‘universalism’–unfortunately. I rarely refer to myself as a ‘universalist’–only here and with my husband, since he’s been educated to the term. I just say something along the lines of, “I believe everyone will eventually accept Christ, and God will never stop trying to save any of the lost.”

Sonia

[Aaron37]

I lol’ed at the listing of “Dwane”. I must confess I’ve never heard of him…

Interestingly, Martin Zender, who clearly believes in the ultimate salvation of all does not consider himself a “universalist”, given his definition of universalism, which is that a universalist is “someone who believes God will let everyone into heaven simply because He’s a nice guy”. Or something to that effect…

That is what most people think of when they hear the word ‘universalism’–unfortunately. I rarely refer to myself as a ‘universalist’–only here and with my husband, since he’s been educated to the term. I just say something along the lines of, “I believe everyone will eventually accept Christ, and God will never stop trying to save any of the lost.”

Sonia

What about the ones who do not want to accept Christ? What about the lost that stop trying to be saved? Ya know God provided grace, now he needs a response with a thing called “faith”

[SLJ]

What about the ones who do not want to accept Christ? What about the lost that stop trying to be saved?

Those are the only kind of people that need saving–that’s why they’re called the ‘lost.’

The lost are not ‘trying to be saved’ – at least I don’t think they are. If they are, they must be going about it the wrong way, either that, or they don’t know what it means to ‘be saved’.

No one is saved by their ‘trying’ but by their ‘faithing’ in God–and even then we are told “if we are faithless, He remains faithful.”

Sonia

[Aaron37]

What about the ones who do not want to accept Christ? What about the lost that stop trying to be saved?

Those are the only kind of people that need saving–that’s why they’re called the ‘lost.’

The lost are not ‘trying to be saved’ – at least I don’t think they are. If they are, they must be going about it the wrong way, either that, or they don’t know what it means to ‘be saved’.

No one is saved by their ‘trying’ but by their ‘faithing’ in God–and even then we are told “if we are faithless, He remains faithful.”

Sonia

So,the Muslims, Hindus, Buddists, etc… anything that has to do with false religions are not trying to find God and salvation? If you don’t tap into God’s grace with your faith…God’s grace alone wont save you. Grace through faith.

[stellar_renegade]

What about the ones who do not want to accept Christ? What about the lost that stop trying to be saved?

Those are the only kind of people that need saving–that’s why they’re called the ‘lost.’

The lost are not ‘trying to be saved’ – at least I don’t think they are. If they are, they must be going about it the wrong way, either that, or they don’t know what it means to ‘be saved’.

No one is saved by their ‘trying’ but by their ‘faithing’ in God–and even then we are told “if we are faithless, He remains faithful.”

Sonia

So,the Muslims, Hindus, Buddists, etc… anything that has to do with false religions are not trying to find God and salvation? If you don’t tap into God’s grace with your faith…God’s grace alone wont save you. Grace through faith.

So, do you believe that everyone goes into judgment with their eyes wide open, then? In order to be fair, I mean. Otherwise… perhaps you don’t believe that the judgment is fair at all?

Anyway, first of all you say that some will persistently continue to reject Christ without end. I question how that’s even possible. If you truly see how empty a person is apart from God (and if you don’t, I question the extent of your experience of His presence) and how stacked the odds are against someone being satisfied apart from having His Spirit within them, then I don’t think you will be able to honestly make that kind of statement.

It also seems to imply that man’s strength is greater than God’s. That man has greater strength to resist than God does at wooing, coaxing and persuading. God simply has that powerless of a sales pitch to pluck the heartstrings of mankind, because somehow either He’s not desirable enough or people are simply too full of themselves. With the former, God is not glorified to the fullest extent possible, and with the latter, it still implies that people have enough of their “selves” to successfully barricade against the glorious waves of grace that bombard them (and just how great that grace appears to you to be depends on the degree of worship that you give Him). Just the sheer numbers of it should testify against this sort of belief.

Remember the story of Jacob who wrestled with Elohim? He put up a huge fight through the night, but by morning he was walking away with a limp. No man can approach God, much less struggle against Him, and successfully walk away unchanged for the better.

Next, you say that there are those who DO seek God and give examples… very well, are you saying, by terms of contrast, that Muslims, Hindus and Buddhists will be saved? That they will all eventually bow their knee to Christ? Or does your former implication that not all will be saved because some simply don’t want to be or do not seek salvation just not encompass the entire spectrum of those who will not be saved? Some aren’t saved because they do not seek, and some are not saved simply because they seek in the wrong way, or were raised in the wrong foundational worldview, have never heard the gospel or find it impossible to think outside of the paradigm they were raised in?

These are extremely important points to consider, I think, if one is going to choose to be a believer in Everlasting Conscious Torment and Final Judgment.

[RanRan]

God’s grace alone wont save you. Grace through faith.

And where does the ‘faith’ come from? Or even the ability TO believe correctly?

It’s all Grace. How does one ‘tap’ into something that they don’t believe in yet?

[Aaron37]

God’s grace alone wont save you. Grace through faith.

And where does the ‘faith’ come from? Or even the ability TO believe correctly?

It’s all Grace. How does one ‘tap’ into something that they don’t believe in yet?

Just because man is dead spiritually does not mean he is incapable of producing faith for salvation. Spiritually dead means… man can’t seek God on the spiritual level he desires…he is void of spiritual righteousness…but does have the ability to believe …look at the OT saints who were spiritually dead but had the ability to believe God…( Noah, Abraham, etc) No where in the word of God does it say unregenerate man is incapable to believe God. Otherwise, the hall of fame of faith would not be in the bible ( Hebrews 11)