The Evangelical Universalist Forum

SNIPPETS FROM MY HARD COPY UR LIBRARY

Evangelical Universalism Arguments for Evangelical Universalism
#2162

LOVE WINS

Here is an analogy that I got from Ray Prinzing (my earthly hero and mentor)

A man courts a lady by continually expressing his love for her week after week, both verbally, and by bringing her gifts.

If he stops trying to persuade her to marry him, he loses everything.
But if he never stops trying to convince her until she says yes, then he goes to her place, gathers up all the gifts he gave her AND HER, and takes them back to his place for the rest of their lives.

Human love sometimes fails to elicit a loving response, but God’s divine love is not hampered by the limitations of human love.

Even if takes kolasis aionios (age-during corrective chastisement) which is a negative expression of His love, God will sooner or later elicit a loving response from everyone.

That is what I believe.
LOVE WINS
http://lovewins.us/388/an-analytical-study-of-words/

#2163

LOYAL HURLEY

The age following The Great White Throne Judgment is sometimes called by theologians ‘the age of consummation,’ or ‘the age of Jubilee,’ or ‘the age of the New Heaven and New Earth.’
By the time that age has ended, all fallen creatures will have been saved from everything from which they need to be saved, including their stubborn will.

A snippet from THE OUTCOME OF INFINITE GRACE – DR. LOYAL F. HURLEY
“Only as one sees God’s Plan of the Ages do they see the beauty of God’s Program for the redemption of the race.

Heb. 11:3 should read, “Through faith we understand that the ages were planned by the Word of God.” The ages will collectively end. A literal translation of Heb. 9:26 is, ‘But now, once for all, with a view to the end of the ages, has He been manifested to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself.’ (Alexander Thompson’s translation)

Throughout the eons there is sin and evil, condemnation and death. At the end of the eons all will be justified (Rom. 5:18,19), and all will be reconciled through Christ’s blood (Col. 1:20).

GOD’S PLAN FOR THE AGES OF TIME
THE EONS OF THE BIBLE WITH CONCORDANCE
http://www.saviourofall.org/Tracts/Eons2.html

CHRIST TRIUMPHANT – THOMAS ALLIN
It is true that aionios may be applied as an epithet to things that are endless, but the idea of endlessness in all such cases comes not from the epithet, but only because it is inherent in the object to which the epithet is applied, as in the case of God.

‘This is life eternal’ should be ‘the life of the ages,’ i.e. peculiar to those ages in which the scheme of salvation is being worked out. The ‘eternal covenant’ is the ‘covenant of the ages,’ the covenant peculiar to the ages of redemption. The ‘eternal purpose’ is really the purpose of ‘the ages,’ i.e. developed and worked out in ‘the ages.’

We who teach the larger hope believe that not in this brief life only, but through future ages, Christ’s work shall go on till the last straying sheep shall have been found by the Good Shepherd. Then, at the expiry of these ages ‘cometh the end’ when Christ shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, and God shall be All in all (1Cor. 15:28).

#2164

MARTIN LUTHER

I like what Martin Luther said: “God forbid that I should limit the time of acquiring faith to the present life. In the depth of the Divine mercy there may be opportunity to win it in the future.” (Martin Luther’s letter to Hans von Rechenberg, 1522.)

In the conclusion of THE BONDAGE OF THE WILL, Martin Luther wrote
““Even according to the testimony of reason herself there can be no “Free-will”—in man,—in angel,—or in any creature!”
http://www.truecovenanter.com/truelutheran/luther_bow.html#conc

#2165

MISCELLANEOUS QUOTES

“Now in the same manner as God has converted so many to Himself
without destroying their liberty, He can undoubtedly convert whole
nations, or the whole world. And it is as easy to Him to convert a
world as one individual soul.” - John Wesley

“I frankly confess that, for myself, even if it could be, I should not
want free-will to be given me.…But now that God has taken my salvation
out of the control of my own will, and put it under the control of
His, and promised to save me, not according to my working or running,
but according to His own grace and mercy, I have the comfortable
certainty that He is faithful and will not lie to me, and that He is
also great and powerful, so that no devils or opposition can break Him
or pluck me from Him.” -Martin Luther

“for the power of “free-will” is nil, and it does no good, nor can do,
without grace. It follows, therefore, that “free-will” is obviously a
term applicable only to Divine Majesty; for only He can do, and does
(as the Psalmist sings) “whatever he wills in heaven and earth”
[Psalms 135:6]. If “free-will” is ascribed to men, it is ascribed with
no more propriety than divinity itself would be - and no blasphemy
could exceed that! So it befits theologians to refrain from using the
term when they want to speak of human ability, and to leave it to be
applied to God only.” –Martin Luther

“God forbid that I should limit the time of acquiring faith to the
present life. In the depth of the Divine mercy there may be
opportunity to win it in the future… For the opinion that God could
not have created man to be rejected and cast away into eternal torment
is held among us also…” -Martin Luther, letter to Hans von Rechenberg,
1522

“How ironic that those who believe God will not violate the ‘free’
will of man have no problem believing He will violate His own free
will—that all men should be saved!” - David Nuckols

“He does not save men by arbitrary force. He saves by their wills,
through moral influence. God has resources in his universe, the all
conquering agencies of love, to make the unwilling soul willing! He
has light enough to make the blind see, and love enough to melt the
hardened heart.” -Quillen Hamilton Shinn

"The healthy man does not torture others.” Carl Jung

“Before you embark on a journey of revenge, dig two graves.” Confucius

“In order for the light to shine so brightly, the darkness must be
present.” Sir Francis Bacon

“Out of suffering have emerged the strongest souls. The most massive
characters are seared with scars.” Khalil Gibran

“There can be no good without evil.” Russian proverb

“It is a wise father that knows his own child.” William Shakespeare

“Man must evolve for all human conflict a method which rejects
revenge, aggression and retaliation. The foundation of such a method
is love.” Martin Luther King, Jr.

“I have always found that mercy bears richer fruit than strict
justice.” Abraham Lincoln

“There is no lasting hope in violence, only temporary relief from
hopelessness.” Kingman Brewster, Jr.

“All humanity is one undivided and indivisible family. I cannot detach
myself from the wickedest soul.” Mahatma Ghandi

“Love feels no burden, thinks nothing of its trouble, attempts what is
above its strength, pleads no excuse for impossibility, for it thinks
all things are lawful for itself and all things are possible.” Thomas
A. Kempis

“No man chooses evil because it is evil; he only mistakes it for
happiness, the good he seeks.” Mary Wollstonecraft Shelley

“What really raises one’s indignation against suffering is not
suffering intrinsically, but the senselessness of suffering.”
Frederich Nietzsche

“Adversity is like a strong wind. It tears away from us all but the
things that cannot be torn, so that we see ourselves as we truly are.”
Arthur Golden

“I’m for truth no matter who tells it. I’m for justice no matter who
it’s for or against.” Malcolm X

#2166

MOTIVATION

Philippians 1:15-18

“Some preach Christ because of envy and strife, and some of good will.
One preaches Christ out of contention, not sincerely, the other out of love.
What then, notwithstanding, every way, whether in pretense or in truth, Christ is being preached.
And I therein do rejoice, yea, and will rejoice.”

ETers and ANers preach Christ out of the false motivation that if they don’t preach many
will suffer forever in “hell” or be annihilated.
But even so, like Paul, I rejoice and, yea, I will rejoice that Christ is being preached.

#2167

ETERNAL PUNISHMENT CHRISTIANS VERSUS ETERNAL PUNISHMENT MUSLIMS
Click on “See More”

As most Christians already know, millions of Christians believe that millions of Muslims (and all other non-Christians too) are going to suffer forever in hell.
They believe it because that’s the way they were taught by their parents and by other people on whom they relied to tell them the truth.

What many Christians do not know is that millions of Muslims believe that millions of Christians (and all non-Muslims) are going to suffer forever in hell too.
And they also believe it because that’s the way they were taught by their parents and by other people on whom they relied to tell them the truth
Quote from THE AFTER LIFE IN ISLAM
“Being a Muslim does not keep one out of Hell, but non-Muslims (kafir), however, will be punished eternally.”
That is why they believe they are doing God’s work when they make a project out of killing non-Muslim “infidels” if they refuse to convert to Islam.

I think the entire dichotomy is ridiculous!
I think that the idea of “eternal hell” may be the cause of more suffering on this earth than any other idea that exists.

In my opinion the greatest of all manifestations of God’s grace in action on this earth is that anyone can believe that God will let anyone choose themselves into an inescapable state of everlasting suffering and not go insane thinking about it.

For anyone who is interested, the following is a very informative link
http://what-the-hell-is-hell.com/topics/hell-scholars-corner/

#2168

GOD’S PLAN FOR THE AGES OF TIME

While believers are enjoying life eonian, unbelievers will experience kolasis eonian which means age-during corrective chastisement. When the corrective chastisement has been achieved in everyone who needs it, then both life eonian and chastisement eonian will come to an end and eternity will continue with everyone saved from everything from which they need to be saved, including their stubborn will.

A snippet from
GOD’S PLAN FOR THE AGES OF TIME
“During the present wicked eon (Gal.1:4), Sin reigns, Satan who is said to be “the god of this eon” (2 Cor.4:4) blinds and deceives mankind, and death swallows up the race (1 Cor.15:22). But notwithstanding, God is over all and is in supreme control. He is the eonian God. In due time He will deliver the entire creation and bring good out of all the suffering mankind is called upon to endure (Rom.8;18-23).”

GOD’S PLAN FOR THE AGES OF TIME
THE EONS OF THE BIBLE WITH CONCORDANCE
http://www.saviourofall.org/Tracts/Eons2.html

#2169

The age following The Great White Throne Judgment is sometimes called by theologians ‘the age of consummation,’ or ‘the age of Jubilee,’ or ‘the age of the New Heaven and New Earth.’
By the time that age has ended, all fallen creatures will have been saved from everything from which they need to be saved, including their stubborn will.

A snippet from THE OUTCOME OF INFINITE GRACE – LOYAL F. HURLEY

“Only as one sees God’s Plan of the Ages do they see the beauty of God’s Program for the redemption of the race.

Heb. 11:3 should read, “Through faith we understand that the ages were planned by the Word of God.” The ages will collectively end. A literal translation of Heb. 9:26 is, ‘But now, once for all, with a view to the end of the ages, has He been manifested to put away sin by the sacrifice of Himself.’

Throughout the eons there is sin and evil, condemnation and death. At the end of the eons all will be justified (Rom. 5:18,19), and all will be reconciled through Christ’s blood (Col. 1:20).

GOD’S PLAN FOR THE AGES OF TIME
THE EONS OF THE BIBLE WITH CONCORDANCE
http://www.saviourofall.org/Tracts/Eons2.html

#2170

MUST AION MEAN ETERNAL? – PHILIP SCRANTON

"There are many texts in which aion and aionios cannot bear the meaning of eternity. And there are no texts in which the meaning of a limited period of time does not make reasonable sense. Our great loss is that when we ascribe the meaning of eternity to these words, we obliterate from view God’s purpose of the eons. Further, the character of God is slandered, making Him the inflictor of incomprehensible woe.

It does not say that “all in Christ shall be made alive.” It says, “in Christ shall all be made alive.” The word for made alive means to be made immortal. After the great white throne, the unbelieving will participate in the second death – the lake of fire. Finally, at the consummation, when death is abolished, all will be made alive in Christ."

God is working all things after the counsel of His will and according to His perfect schedule. But the improper translation of “for the ages of the ages” ignores the purpose and climax of history. The holies of the holies (plural/plural) were the two inner confines of the tabernacle. They were more holy than the outer court and the camp and all the places outside the camp. In like manner, the ages of the ages are the two greatest ages of history because of what will transpire during their time. It does not cast the smallest shadow on the brilliance of God’s glory to say that glory be attributed to Him during the climatic eons when His purpose will be realized by all and His glory seen more clearly than ever before."

#2171

Regarding the words translated “forever and ever”
From AN ANALYTICAL STUDY OF WORDS – Louis Abbott

"As mentioned previously, there are several analogous expressions in the Scriptures which should show the meaning of the words under discussion. In Ex. 26:33 (LXX), tou hagiou ton hagion, “in the holy of the holies.” This is similar to the “eon of the eons” of Eph. 3:21. In IKings 8:6 (LXX) we see, eis ta hagia ton hagion, “for the holies of the holies”-similar to “eons of the eons.” The “holy of the holies” and “holies of the holies” refer to the tabernacle. Psalm 44:7 says, ho thronos sou ho theos, eis ton aiona tou aionos, “Thy throne, O God, is for the eon of eon”-similar to Heb. 1:8. Daniel 7:18: “until eon of the eons” and similar to that of Eph. 3:21, where a singular is followed by a plural, “eon of the eons.” In these expressions we see the eons corresponding to the holies in the tabernacle.
While there are many different teachings on the types in the Tabernacle of Moses, it should not be too difficult to see that there were at least five divisions: (1) without the camp; (2) in the camp; (3) in the court; (4) in the holy place; and (5) in the holy of holies. These may be likened to the five eons we find in the Scriptures (past eons, present eon, future eons). The last eon is called the “eon of the eons,” because it, like the “holy of holies,” is the climax of the others. In Hebrews chapter 9, the Greek text of Nestle reads (margin v. 25), eis ta hagia ton hagion, “into the holies of the holies,” and (v. 3), hagia hagion, “holies of holies.” Just as the two holy places in the tabernacle are called the holies of holies, so the last two eons are often called the eons of the eons.
As the tabernacle illustrated man’s approach to God, it corresponds closely with the eonian times, which also brings man to God. The “holy of holies” was a single holy place. The “eon of eons,” a single eon. It was the pre-eminence of the “holy of holies,” in relation to the other holy places, which caused it to be so designated. So the pre-eminence of the “eon of the eons” lies in its being the fruitage and harvest of previous eons. The same is true of the “holies of the holies” of Heb. 9:25. They may be likened to the “eons of the eons” of Rev. 11:15; 22:5.
Quoted from AN ANALYTICAL STUDY OF WORDS – Louis Abbott
“Forever and Ever”–A Poor Translation
http://www.tentmaker.org/books/asw/Chapter5.html

#2172

THE UNIVERSAL RESTORATION – ELHANAN WINCHESTER
In the memoir of the author it is written, “He found no quietude, until, by a candid and prayerful examination of the Bible, he became fully satisfied that ‘God will have all men to be saved,’ and that ‘He doeth according to His will.’ His change of opinion was soon noised abroad, and produced a great disaffection in many of his former friends.

Here is a snippet from the book.
“The reason why I do not conceive that “forever and ever” doth intend endless duration is because I find the words as often used for times and periods that must have an end, as you find them used for the misery of the wicked. You bring three passages which are all that are to be found in the whole Bible where they are used in that sense; I shall now invalidate those evidences for endless damnation by bringing an equal number of texts where you will allow the words are used in a limited sense. Is. 30:8; Jer. 7:7; Jer. 35:5.
These passages are as many and as strongly expressed as those which you brought to prove endless misery; and yet nothing can be more evident than that they cannot intend endless duration. The words do not necessarily imply that the wicked shall never be delivered from their sins and consequent suffering.
Now if the words “forever and ever” signify without end, then there is a contradiction that cannot be reconciled, but only understand them as the ages of the ages, (as indeed they ought to be rendered), and the whole difficulty vanishes at once.”

#2173

GOD’S PLAN FOR THE AGES OF TIME

While the righteous are enjoying life eonian, the unrighteous will experience kolasis eonian which means age-during corrective chastisement. When the corrective chastisement has been achieved in everyone who needs it, then both life eonian and chastisement eonian will come to an end and eternity will continue with everyone saved from everything from which they need to be saved, including their stubborn will.

A snippet from
GOD’S PLAN FOR THE AGES OF TIME
“During the present wicked eon (Gal.1:4), Sin reigns, Satan who is said to be “the god of this eon” (2 Cor.4:4) blinds and deceives mankind, and death swallows up the race (1 Cor.15:22). But notwithstanding, God is over all and is in supreme control. He is the eonian God. In due time He will deliver the entire creation and bring good out of all the suffering mankind is called upon to endure (Rom.8;18-23).”

GOD’S PLAN FOR THE AGES OF TIME
THE EONS OF THE BIBLE WITH CONCORDANCE
http://www.saviourofall.org/Tracts/Eons2.html

Many Greek scholars agree with John Wesley Hanson
AIÓN – AIÓNIOS
http://www.tentmaker.org/books/Aion_lim.html

SEE

THE SCHOLAR’S CORNER FOR THE STUDY OF BIBLICAL UNIVERSALISM
http://www.tentmaker.org/ScholarsCorner.html

BIBLE THREATENINGS EXPLAINED
http://www.tentmaker.org/books/BibleThreateningsExplained.html

#2174

Jesus did not speak English, and neither were the scriptures written in English.

Jesus did not ever say the words “eternal life”. In John 3:16 Jesus promises eonian life (greek: aionios zoe), which quite literally means something of which the horizon/end-point is not in view, but can more generally have the meaning of “pertaining to an age or ages” ie. age-abiding.

Do not confuse this with the idea of immortality - which is also a promise as shown by Paul in 1 Cor 15: 53-57. This is why all will be alive truly forever. Not because of eonian life, but because immortality is granted.

It has caused much confusion and travesty due to the way modern Christian tradition has munged the terms “eternal life” and “immortality”.
There are many examples where the word eon and its Hebrew counter-part olam simply cannot mean literally “eternal” or “forever”, yet the meaning is forced there when it is not warranted.

You can study this for yourself if you wish to honestly understand.

Christian Universalism understands what immortality is and what it means to put it on as scripture defines it. That does not change simply because Jesus was talking about an undetermined period of time.

#2175

ABOUT THE WORD AIONIOS
Dean Hough, director of THE SAVIOUR OF ALL FELLOWSHIP wrote “The definition given in THE VOCABULARY OF THE GREEK TESTAMENT (edited by James Hope Moulton and George Milligan) is helpful. Concerning aionios we read, “In general, the word depicts that of which the horizon is not in view . . .” (p.16). If the horizon of the extermination spoken of by Paul in 2 Thessalonians 1:9 is simply not in view, then we can see that what Paul says in 1 Corinthians 15:22 can truly occur. The same all who are dying in Adam, which includes some who incur eonian extermination, can indeed eventually be vivified in Christ.
The Bible, in fact, does not speak of judgment and condemnation, death and destruction, hades and Gehenna, or any of these serious consequences of sin, as unending. It may refer to them as not having the end in view, but none of these fearful works of God can keep Him from achieving His will (1Tim.2:4); reconciling all through the blood of Christ’s cross (Col.1:20, and becoming All in all (1 Cor.15:28).”
Dean Hough

#2176

A snippet from THE GREEK WORD AION – AIONIOS TRANSLATED EVERLASTING – ETERNAL IN THE HOLY BIBLE SHOWN TO DENOTE LIMITED DURATION – JOHN WESLEY HANSON

“The word aidios (not aionios) was in universal use among the non-Christian Greek Jews of our Savior’s day, to convey the idea of eternal duration, and was used by them to teach endless punishment.

Jesus never allowed himself to use it in connection with punishment, nor did any of His disciples but one, and he but once, and then carefully and expressly limited its meaning. Can demonstration go further than this to show that Jesus carefully avoided the phraseology by which His contemporaries described the doctrine of endless punishment? Jesus never adopted the language of His day on this subject. Their language was aidios timoria, endless torment. His language was aionion kolasin, age-lasting correction. They described unending ruin, He, discipline, resulting in reformation.”
See this link.
http://www.tentmaker.org/books/Aion_lim.html
See the first item under APPENDIX
AIDIOS – AN IMPORTANT WORD CONSIDERED

#2177

THE UNIVERSAL RESTORATION – ELHANAN WINCHESTER

In the memoir of the author it is written, “He found no quietude, until, by a candid and prayerful examination of the Bible, he became fully satisfied that ‘God will have all men to be saved,’ and that ‘He doeth according to His will.’ His change of opinion was soon noised abroad, and produced a great disaffection in many of his former friends.

Here is a snippet from the book.
“The reason why I do not conceive that “forever and ever” doth intend endless duration is because I find the words as often used for times and periods that must have an end, as you find them used for the misery of the wicked. You bring three passages which are all that are to be found in the whole Bible where they are used in that sense; I shall now invalidate those evidences for endless damnation by bringing an equal number of texts where you will allow the words are used in a limited sense. Is. 30:8; Jer. 7:7; Jer. 35:5.
These passages are as many and as strongly expressed as those which you brought to prove endless misery; and yet nothing can be more evident than that they cannot intend endless duration. The words do not necessarily imply that the wicked shall never be delivered from their sins and consequent suffering.

Now if the words “forever and ever” signify without end, then there is a contradiction that cannot be reconciled, but only understand them as the ages of the ages, (as indeed they ought to be rendered), and the whole difficulty vanishes at once.”

#2178

If I declared or implied that “aionion” means limited in time, having a beginning and ending, then I misspoke. Aionion means relating or pertaining to part, the remainder, or the entirety of one or more eons. It is most often used in reference to the oncoming eons (the eons of the eons), either together or separately. The Greek of the NT has eon, eonian, eon of the eons, eon of the eon, conclusion of the eons, the on-coming eons, for the eons, from the eons, the eons of the eons, the present eon, conclusion of the eon, etc. There is also “before the eons” (1Cor. 2:7).
To say that someone or something is eonian is not to declare the subject eternal, but it may also be eternal. In conclusion, the etymology of “aionion” refers to a limited period of time, but it does not limit anyone or anything that other evidence shows to exist, operate, or apply either before and/or after the eon(s) in question.
Just as God is the God of Israel and the God of the universe, God is eonian (for He created the eons for a purpose, and is to be especially relied upon during the eons, when sin is in operation), as well as existing as the only Supreme Sovereign both before and after the eons.
Kenneth Larson

#2179

THE AGES IN THE SCRIPTURES – VLADIMIR GELESNOFF

“Words are inadequate to describe the harm which has resulted from confounding the ages with eternity.

The Greek and Hebrew terms rendered ‘forever and ever,’ ‘eternal,’ ‘everlasting’ never refer to endlessness; but to a series of terminable periods know as age-times. These ages are periods in which God carries on remedial work, but they have a conclusion and pass away when the purpose to be accomplished in them has been realized. The ages are never synonymous with endlessness but always distinct therefrom.

That the words translated ‘forever and ever’ are associated with the hereafter of both believer and unbeliever is true; but in the case of both it is limited to the span of the ages, and has not the remotest reference to the final state of either. Therefore the dogmas of endless agony and endless sin rest on purely imaginary premises and are without the slightest shred of biblical support.”

#2180

CHRIST TRIUMPHANT – THOMAS ALLIN

It is true that aionios may be applied as an epithet to things that are endless, but the idea of endlessness in all such cases comes not from the epithet, but only because it is inherent in the object to which the epithet is applied, as in the case of God.

‘This is life eternal’ should be ‘the life of the ages,’ i.e. peculiar to those ages in which the scheme of salvation is being worked out. The ‘eternal covenant’ is the ‘covenant of the ages,’ the covenant peculiar to the ages of redemption. The ‘eternal purpose’ is really the purpose of ‘the ages,’ i.e. developed and worked out in ‘the ages.’

We who teach the larger hope believe that not in this brief life only, but through future ages, Christ’s work shall go on till the last straying sheep shall have been found by the Good Shepherd. Then, at the expiry of these ages ‘cometh the end’ when Christ shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, and God shall be All in all (1Cor. 15:28).

#2181

GOD’S PERFECT PLAN
“Many attempts have been made to prove that eons are eternal. The Greek word aion and the Hebrew olam, both meaning age or eon, have been translated by terms meaning endlessness. This is a grave error, for the divine Author, Himself has not used them in this way. He has indicated that they were not eternal in the past by informing us that they had a beginning (1Cor. 2:7), and, again, that they cannot possibly be everlasting in the future, for they are to end (Heb. 9:26; 1Cor. 10:11).

God’s plan for creation is confined to time. It is not an ‘eternal’ purpose’ but a ‘purpose of the eons’ (Eph. 3:11). Beyond the ages there will be naught but bliss and perfection for every member of creation (Rom. 8:19-22). Sin and evil and death will then be past; all will be saved and reconciled, and God shall be All, not in a few, but in all (1Cor. 15:28).”

GOD’S PLAN FOR THE AGES OF TIME
THE EONS OF THE BIBLE WITH CONCORDANCE
http://www.saviourofall.org/Tracts/Eons2.html