The Evangelical Universalist Forum

"Who Wouldn't Want to Believe UR?"

Really good discussion here guys :slight_smile:

And I really liked your first and your most recent comment, James :slight_smile:

What you said in your last comment brings up something that Iā€™ve been wanting to discuss, and might well be worthy of itā€™s own thread, namely the most difficult thing about believing in UR, which is looking at your life and looking all around you and seeing that this ā€˜universal reconciliationā€™ is only a hope and not a present reality.

Like you pointed out, itā€™s the hardest road, because it means everyone will have to work out their differences some time or another, one way or another. I have had a lot of relationships fade away and fall apart over the years, with family, friends, co-workers, lovers, etc, and thinking about it makes me feel kind of heavy, because there are some things I just donā€™t have the power to fix, even though Iā€™ve tried. Reconciliation is two-sided, and if the other side doesnā€™t want to work things out, then thereā€™s not much you can do.
I admit I could try harder, but sometimes it feels like the other person usually doesnā€™t even want to try, at least in most cases in my own life.

For this reason believing in universalism is painful in a way, because it gives me more of a desire to reconcile with everybody, more than I did before, but then Iā€™m not able to, and I beat myself up for not loving others enough, for not giving enough, for not being able to work things out or connect or stay connected orā€¦ Iā€™m sure you guys get the picture. :neutral_face:

But itā€™s also a hope, and I have hope that one day I will be able to work things out with all of the people in my life that Iā€™m estranged from or at odds with right now, and if not in this life then in the next one.

At the moment I feel like I have a lot of issues and problems, things about me that I believe need to change, but Iā€™m trying to remember that God alone can really change me for the better, can help me to relate to others better, can help me to make peace, can help me to love, and just as God can work with me, he can work with all of those people that I need to reconcile with, and then one day he can bring us together and we can finally be at peace with one another, and truly love another, on both ends.

Everyone reconciling with God is hard enough to believe, but itā€™s easy by comparison when you think of everyone reconciling with one another.
Now that would be a real miracle.

Anyways, that was just something that was on my mind.

Steve, if you think that topic, about the difficulty of reconciling with others, of how UR is a hope and not yet a present reality, and how do we live with that and move forward, is worthy of another thread, feel free to move my post from here to a new thread of that topic, if you like. :slight_smile:

Blessings to all of you and thanks for the good discussion :slight_smile:

  • Matt

I have been a Christian universalist for about 20 years now. In all that time, I have convinced exactly 2 Christians of universalism. Iā€™ve mentioned universalism and at times argued for it to a great many Christians. Virtually none of them were even remotely interested in it. Apparently part of the attraction of Christianity for some Christians is that they receive the satisfaction of thinking that ________ [fill in the blank] are going to endlessly burn in Hell.

The case for universalism is easily strong enough that anyone who, for emotional/psychological reasons, wanted to believe in it, could simply switch over to universalism. But very, very few people do switch over to universalism, in spite of the ease in doing so. Why?

Sadly enough, I can only conclude that some Christians would feel cheated if they couldnā€™t contemplate the endless suffering of _________.

Thus, I think this is the answer to the charge that we universalists believe in universalism merely to make ourselves feel good. If this were true, we would be very unusual people. If the great mass of people would jump at the chance of being universalists, then most people would already be universalists. We wouldnā€™t be a little minority.*