Jason PRATT believes that there is an endless aion (the aion of the second death is only a part of the big aion) , but the unbelievers will not be tormented forever in his view
my question is : maybe the aion of the second death is eternal, people are tormented forever, aion means both forever and age ,
God wants that people know that people will be tormented in an aion (not in a time out of an aion) and that this aion is forever ?
i am sorry to create so much topics , but i really think that it is possible that the bible contains puns
thank you very much for your help
There is no “big aion” which lasts forever. “Aion” means age, and that’s it. However, the ages will doubtless go on forever, each age succeeded by another.
Also, I don’t know why you think “aionios is a pun”? A pun is a play on words such as the following riddle:
Question: Two little morons were sitting on a fence. One fell off; why didn’t the other?
Answer: Because he was a little moron (a little more on).
Hi Erwan,
Your questions are great! Don’t worry about it.
I think you’re trying to figure out how it’s possible that God would say he will torment people in a limited age and that it will also be forever.
Speaking of things such as “an endless aion” is nonsense. It literally makes no sense. As paidion has said, an aion is an age. A very long age perhaps, but nevertheless an age. It is concerning time. An age has a beginning and an end. Endless is the opposite of an age. Speaking of “an endless aion” is like saying that black is white.
When translated correctly, the Bible contains no contradictions. The big problem is finding an accurate translation.
If God torments people at all (I have my doubts - judgment yes, correction yes, torment not so sure) it will be for a limited time period. This time period is the 2nd death. We know for sure that it does not go forever, since there will be a time when death is abolished and God will be all in all. This is not difficult to understand. Rejoice in the simplicity of it!
I think the better question is, what do the scriptures say will happen in the Day of the Lord to come?
The short answer is: quite a lot of things! But I (and other universalists) would argue that this includes ultimately total success in evangelization of a total scope.
In defense of my belief that there is an endless Day of the Lord coming (which in many senses has also already started at different times in the past), I cannot quite imagine writing something like this instead:
I think there are good arguments against non-universalists who uncritically appeal to translations of eon and its forms, but I wouldn’t ever use that kind of argument as represented above.
If there is an endless Day of the Lord with finally permanent results of some kind (even if there are distinct stages in reaching those results and long periods of time to get to those results), stretching across endless ages, then there is by the same poetic analogy an endless “Age” of the Lord, too, encompassing endless ages and ages of ages. Which doesn’t mean that a reference to ages and ages of ages in the scriptures necessarily implies endlessness–but neither by the same token can endlessness be necessarily excluded on terminology grounds. Context, from immediate to local to extended, must determine.
Whereas, if the Day/Age of the Lord means merely some long limited period of time with no permanent results, then neither will death ever be abolished nor God ever finally be all in all; eventually there will be a reversal again for those persons, and an endless cycle of falling and rising for the same persons. Which would not be universal salvation from sin, or anyway a very peculiar one–I would hardly encourage anyone to rejoice in the simplicity of it. I know my hope isn’t that I will continually fall and be saved over and over again forever. But then there must finally be an endless period of time where I am either permanently finally saved from sin or lost to sin forever. (Or I’m annihilated at some point after being saved so that I cease to exist–which could hardly be of any benefit to me either.)
maybe (i recognize to be far to know the bible very well) believers don’t need any purification (Jesus paid for them)
unbelievers need to be purified in the lake of fire
the day of the lord ends at the end of the second death: the believers need Jesus no more, the second death, the lake of fire is destroyed
when people need jesus no more, Jesus stops reigning
No Erwan. Jesus didn’t “pay” for some people so that they don’t have to repent (have a change of heart and mind) and be purified whereas others who did not get “paid for” must be purified. God doesn’t show partiality.
For everyone will be salted with fire. (Mark 9:49)
Fire purifies and salt preserves from decay. EVERYONE needs that purification.
Everyone will be judged on the basis of their works. No exceptions! No “payment” for particular people!
*For he will render to everyone according to his works: to those who by perseverance in well‑doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, he will give lasting life; but for those who are self-seeking and are not persuaded by the truth, but are persuaded by wickedness, there will be wrath and fury.
Affliction and anguish for every person who does evil … but glory and honour and well-being for every one who does good … For God shows no partiality. (Romans 2:6-11)*
The purpose of Christ’s death is not to pay for the sins of certain people. His death was to provide enabling grace to ALL so that they might overcome wrongdoing and to live righteously. The following verses tell why Christ died:
*I Peter 2:24 He himself endured our sins in his body on the tree, that we might die to sin and live to righteousness. By his wounds you have been healed.
II Corinthians 5:15 And he died for all, that those who live might live no longer for themselves but for him who for their sake died and was raised.
Romans 14:9 For to this end Christ died and lived again, that he might be Lord both of the dead and of the living.
Titus 2:14 who gave himself for us to redeem us from all iniquity and to purify for himself a people of his own who are zealous for good deeds.
Heb 9:26 …he has appeared once for all at the end of the age to do away with sin by the sacrifice of himself.
*
Very much agreed with Paidion on that one. 
To which I will add (as Paidion will no doubt also recall) the classic George MacDonald observation (from his sermon on “Justice”, one of his specifically universalistic sermons), that King David had a revelation at the end of one of his Psalms of what it means for God to pay out a man according to his work:
God’s power and God’s mercy (or lovingkindness, depending on how it is translated into English) are two things that are ultimately one thing in God.
That’s the context in which we should read other scriptural affirmations that YHWH is coming to pay a man according to his work–including when the affirmation somehow involves powerful punishment: the power and the lovingkindness are one and the same thing for God, even in punishment.
Relatedly, the verb there at Psalm 62:11-12, {shawlam}, also supports this: it’s a primitive word meaning ‘to make safe’, closely related to the word for peace, and involving by metaphorical application several actions with extremely beneficial intentions and goals for the one being acted toward, such as fairly paying (which is how it is typically translated in English here), completing, saving, being friendly, making amends, to perfect, to make good, to make prosper, to make a peace treaty.
A person needs to understand aion, aionios, etc. prior to even concluding their doctrines within it. I also believe in an aionios day which never ends will occur, but that is because the Scripture explain it very clearly and it happens after hell is emptied and after all have resurrected from the dead (righteous and wicked) and all have been redeemed and made new. It is the day where night never returns and thus the day never ends, and His Name is Jesus and all other aion or aionios thing end in Him.