The Evangelical Universalist Forum

All ECT's please participate and answer honestly

Already gave you an answer just replied to your response. You just don’t get when you leave scripture in context UR goes bye-bye. You and everyone else on this board are believing a doctrine that has been declared “heresy” for almost 2000 years. :wink: I believe in a doctrine that has been the position of the body of Christ since Jesus taught it. Who doesn’t get it, Jeff? :wink:

And yet, when we talk about those same scriptures you listed in context, you disregard it… :unamused:

Well, at least you (finally) participated, even if you aren’t willing to understand that when people in your other thread answered with “no, not one”, they might also be doing so having “honestly” and “unbiasedly” looked into the matter, no less so (from their perspective) than you (from your perspective) have done so.

And yet, your version of the context of those same scriptures have been declared “heresy” for almost 2000 years and my context of them have been the position of the body of Christ since Jesus taught them. :unamused: :wink: Go figure, Jason.

Well the Sadduces and Pharisees had been ‘right’ for how long when a bunch of ne’er-do-wells came along and upset the apple cart (or was it the money-changer’s tables) :wink:

and of course only 1 out of 6 early theological schools taught ECT - that’s long before your position became ‘orthodox’.

So what you’re saying only 1 out of 6 theological schools did not veer off the teaching of Jesus 2000 years ago. Thanks for the history lesson, Jeff. :smiley: The belief in universalism was NOT widespread at all in the early church, nor has it ever been a widely held belief. It is, however, a belief that has been gaining ground for the past 100 years due to the apostasy of the church prophesied in 2 Thess 2:3. :wink:

And yet, your Protestant disregard of various “catholic” beliefs has been declared “heresy” for almost 2000 years, and still is by the strong majority of Christians on the planet. In fact, your position on the necessity of speaking in tongues as a sign of true baptism in the Holy Spirit is (and has historically been) not only rejected by the vast majority of the body of Christ, but is even rejected by the vast majority of charismatic congregations.

No Protestant, and especially no super-minority among Protestants, is ever going to succeed in bluffing anyone on any topic about a claim that the majority is (and has been) wrong. Which we’ve been over before, but which you keep forgetting. Go figure, Aaron.

Your attempt at trying to connect Christian belief in God’s salvation of sinners from sin and back into loyalty with God under the headship of Christ, with the apostasy of the antichrist, has spectacularly failed every time you’ve attempted it, Aaron. Are you sure you want to go this route again?

Because the antichrist, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called ‘god’ and above every object of worship, so that he takes his seat in the temple of God, displaying himself as being the God (which is the kind of apostasy Paul was talking about at 2 Thess 2:3-4), would be (quite literally) just about the last person (except maybe Satan) who would go around encouraging people to believe that God in Christ, through the blood of His cross, does and shall reconcile all things to Himself, whether those things are in the heaven or on the earth. No rebel against God would seriously teach that all rebels against God shall eventually, thanks to God, cease rebelling, repent of their sins, and become loyal servants of God again (in many cases after having been punished by God).

Did I touch a nerve, Jason? My position of the baptism in the Holy Spirit with the evidence of speaking in tongues has been the position of the body of Christ since Paul taught it. :wink: The devil has done a fine job deceiving and keeping genuine Christians from this gift.

I’m not going to bring up all the heretical doctrines that the Roman Catholic church teach and their “dark ages” history.

Yes, I did touch a nerve. The church’s apostasy ushers in the son of perdition, Jason. The church falls away first and then the son of perdition is revealed with the help of the apostate church. Off to work, have a good day. :wink:

You are confusing your personal opinion with fact again.

Also Jason I’m still trying to figure out your theory on how God himself is evangelizing all the people in hell right now and fails to bring one to salvation. Why aren’t these people accepting God’s invitation, Jason? God must be one lousy evangelist. hmmmm. :blush:

That’s a different thread surely? :slight_smile:

So once again your argument from majority doctrine fails, when it stops being our minority doctrine and starts becoming your minority doctrines. As expected.

Otherwise a universalist could answer just as easily, “Our position of God’s persistent salvation of all sinners from sin has been the position of the body of Christ since Paul taught it. :wink: The devil has done a fine job deceiving and keeping genuine Christians from this hope of the gospel.”

And looking at them Jesus said to them, “With people this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.”
-Matthew 19:26

:laughing:

Which isn’t my theory, which you keep conveniently ignoring. hmmm. :blush:

But as it happens I replied to that thread this morning before working on this one, too. :wink:

That’s because I touched a nerve. :laughing:

Did you or did you not tell me God himself is evangelizing everyone in Hades/Hell right now? If you deny this I will provide the proof. :wink:

:laughing: But that would not be true because the body of Christ has never held the position of UR. It has never ever been the position of the church, Jason. :smiley:

Did I or did I not bold and underline the portion from your quote that I have always consistently denied believing, namely that God fails to bring even one of them to salvation?

Since I deny believing God fails to bring even one of them to salvation, and have always consistently denied believing it (despite your desperate attempts to paint me as believing it), then you aren’t talking about my theory.

Only if by “the body of Christ” you mean the majority. But then you stop appealing to the majority as the body of Christ when you want to defend your own minority and even super-minority positions as being what “the body of Christ” has “always” believed.

That’s a flagrant double-standard for your own convenience: you want the majority to count when you think it’s in your favor, and for the majority not to count when you think it’s against your version of Christianity (in which case then the minority and even super-minority position that you hold becomes the ‘real’ body of Christ instead of the majority.)