Randy seems a bit baffled also 
(not to put words in someone else’s mouth.) 
While I really don’t like RYO (i.e. Roll Your Own) theology, I hate RYO acronyms even more. I should be able to take an acronym and put it into either Bing or Google. And its expansion should show up on page 1. If that doesn’t happen, then spell them out. Make sense 
https://cdn.andertoons.com/img/toons/cartoon6768.png
There was an interesting article today, from the Protestant site Patheos at Solo scriptura vs. sola scriptura, I am quoting a segment - for reflection:
I think “the mistake of evangelicals is” laid out in the sentence immediately prior to this one. 
Randy, here’s a site that might help relieve your frustration with ACNs (I mean “acronyms”):
Well thanks, Jeff, but you are not addressing the questions 
Look forward to your response
God didn’t forsake Him. He FELT as if God had forsaken Him. Though the Son of God, He became fully human, and so He had human emotions like any other man. So at the crucial moment, He cried out, “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?”
Here is the evidence that God did not forsake Him:
Hebrews 5:7 ESV) In the days of his flesh, Jesus offered up prayers and supplications, with loud cries and tears, to him who was able to save him from death, and he was heard because of his reverence.
God heard Him. Did God just listen to his loud cries and watch his tears and do nothing about it? Or when it says “He was heard because of his reverence,” does this indicate that God did answer his prayers and supplications?
Now clearly God didn’t save Him from death. However the Greek should be translated “Him who was able to save Him out of death.” And that God did, by raising Him from the dead.
YES!!
[size=150]Exactly[/size]
Hmmm still trying to understand your disconnect.
Perhaps you are making the same mistake that traditional evangelicals make not recognizing that salvation is multi-dimensional. They say that an individual is transformed and eternally saved the moment they exercise their free will to trust Christ. I think you are saying that a person is transformed and eternally saved the moment Christ died for them. Both these models insist on linking salvation from condemnation and the transformation of the heart away from sin to one event. However, the transformation of the sinner into a Christian is not the same event as 33ad and the cross. Jesus death made a atonement for sin, that is appeased the wrath of God toward our sin, however, it did not change the heart of even one person. Hearts are changed only when the Holy Spirit takes the message of the cross to win people to Christ one by one.
Still confused?
Certainly you would agree that there are criminals in the world that must be imprisoned and punished… assuming that you could play the role of a good earthly judge. So you are a judge and criminals are brought before you: murderers, drug dealers, and thieves. These people need to be arrested, arraigned, tried, convicted, and sent to prison. And that is your job and since you are a good judge you do exactly that. Now suppose you, the judge, wake one day and decide that you no longer will send people to condemnation, but instead you pronounce forgiveness upon all past, present, and future crimes. That is it, all crime is now forgiven. Period. People are offended, but you do it and do it justly by sending your own son to the cross as a substitute. So forgiveness is a done deal.
However, crime still rages. In fact criminals have even heard about forgiveness, but do not care because they love their life of crime. They haven’t hit the wall yet to even understand what an awesome gift has been given to them. So these rebels are saved from final condemnation, but they are hardly saved from crime to live a new life. However, in time some begin to repent and be thankful for forgiveness. You see forgiveness means nothing to the unrepentant. So the unrepentant criminals are handled with grace and will never be eternally condemned, but as long as their hearts are bent on crime they remain criminals and will continue to suffer for their life of crime.
That is the meaning of 2 Cor 5:15…
Simply Christ has died for all and permanently and eternally removed condemnation from all mankind. And some are changed to live a new life through this message. They are Christians, those who LIVE no longer life for themselves, but for Christ. However, the others are spiritually DEAD men because they refuse to repent and receive forgiveness.
Jeff,
Thanks for the response… Maybe at some point you could answer my questions, but hey, what the heck. You think what you think and I… do the same.
Peace.
Chad
Sorry friend i looked back and cannot find your question. Please restate.
They are reasonable questions… and you seem hesitant to answer.
Look, We can believe different theologies, but your insistence in your insinuation that you are right… I appreciate your vigor, but hey, let’s just slog it back and forth. 
So, here we go brother. 
So maybe you could answer my questions… aye 
Look… you have some beliefs about salvation, and punishment, all I am looking for is your honest response to what you think is going on. 
okay sorry, I see one question in there…
Again salvation is multi-dimensional.
All mankind is saved from condemnation and guaranteed a home in Heaven. So God loves all mankind and his heart is revealed open wide. So all mankind is saved from condemnation. Certainly the promise of a home in Heaven has ‘kicked in’ and is irrevocable. Problem is that unbelievers do not believe it. Their decision to trust Christ and live a new life has not ‘kicked in’. So not all mankind is saved from their sin and unbelief. Take one look around and that is self-evident. The hearts of the unbelieving have not yet been transformed by grace and so they are not saved from the temporal effects of sin and their own enmity toward God, though God holds no enmity toward them. Unbelievers are in the most pitiable state of being. Forever loved and forgiven. They are like heirs to billionaires that are living in poverty. They money is theirs, but until they hear the good news and believe they remain in poverty. Thankfully the grace of God is shining brighter and brighter in this dark world to erase unbelief.
This article might help you dgjc.org/dgjc/saved-5x.
Okay. You said" **All mankind is saved from condemnation and guaranteed a home in Heaven. ** So God loves all mankind and his heart is revealed open wide. So all mankind is saved from condemnation.
Then you said "Problem is that unbelievers do not believe it. Their decision to trust Christ and live a new life has not ‘kicked in’. ** So not all mankind is saved from their sin and unbelief. **
So I will Ask Why you say all mankind is saved from condemnation but then go on to say not all mankind is saved from their sin of unbelief? 
The Bible says Christ has atoned for the sins of all mankind whether they believe it or not, 1 John 2:1-2. So all mankind is saved in that dimension, the most important dimension concerning eternal life. We are eternally loved for God’s part and as far as eternity is concerned God’s part is all that matters. John 3 also says that Christ has condemnation for no one.
The Bible also says that not all have faith, 2 Thessalonians 3:2. The hearts of unbelievers have not been ‘saved’, or transformed that is, to be thankful for Christ and the good news. So not all mankind is saved in that dimension, the temporal dimension of living for Christ in this life and also avoiding punishment for their stubborn unbelief. So for man’s part, not all, in fact most, do not have a saved heart. All mankind is saved eternally, but most remain on the wide path to temporal destruction. They are not saved from the dread temporal consequences of unbelief. Do you think that unbelievers can live like the devil and escape the consequences of their sin because Christ loves them and died for them? Ridiculous! In fact the Bible says that the crimes of unbelievers will be punished MORE severely for those who ignore the revelation of Christ! God is not mocked, Galatians 6:7, Hebrews 10:29. The very love of God will not overlook their unbelief. Just as Christ utterly destroyed Jerusalem for their rejection of their Messiah, so Christ is willing today to destroy the idols of unbelievers making their entire earthly lives a complete waste if they do not repent and turn to Christ. Their names remain secure in Heaven, but otherwise they will have nothing in this life! That is the meaning of 2 Thessalonians 2:9, properly translated by Talbott, “They will be punished with complete destruction at the presence of the Lord and at the majesty of his power.”
I certainly hope you are not guilty of understanding salvation to be mere fire insurance! That is the greatest crime of modern evangelicalism today! They would reduce knowing God to ‘pray this prayer’ and get your name in Heaven. Again ridiculous! The names of every one of God’s people has been penned in Heaven from even before creation! God is not in the business of offering or selling fire insurance! Instead he is in the business of transforming hearts. Certainly, one dimension of salvation is the guarantee of Heaven, but frankly that is a done deal and happened at the cross without our effort. The other dimension of salvation, however, is the transformation of the sinners heart. That dimension of salvation also only happens through the power of God, but also involves our sweat and tears. So again the first piece of business he took care of was guaranteeing that no sin would ever separate his people from his love, through the Lamb slain from the Foundation of the world. After that the Sovereign God decreed the fall to allow for the demonstration of grace and since then he has been winning sinners back into his arms. So repent sooner or repent later, for there is no escape from the salvation victory of his TRANSFORMING love.
But hey do we need Bible verses to prove this? Take a look around. Some follow Christ and some do not. Christ loves us all and he love will not fail, but those who do not follow Christ will not be saved from temporal punishment for their unbelief. In fact the love of Christ will see to it that the wicked are properly chastised.
1) What evidence do you have for this belief i.e., is this anecdotal? What does this “punishment for their stubborn unbelief” actually look like, and HOW do YOU quantify this, apart from you JUST saying it is so?
2) Again… what does THIS look like, as in, what examples can you give that demonstrate THIS “wide path to temporal destruction”?
3) Where did/do you get this “fact” that “the crimes of unbelievers will be punished MORE severely for those who ignore the revelation of Christ”? And, in comparison to who else does this “punished MORE severely” relate, i.e., WHO is punished apparently LESS severely?
4) Can you explain, maybe give evidence of HOW Jesus “is willing today to destroy the idols of unbelievers making their entire earthly lives a complete waste” i.e., what does this destruction and “complete waste” look like “today”?
5) HOW do you apply 2Thess 2:9 to the here-and-now of “this life!”? A prêterist will say this is past, OTOH, a futurist will say this is all still yet to come. So again… HOW can do you apply 2Thess 2:9 in the here-and-now of “this life” as you say it applies? How do you make this work?
I agree with what Paidion has pointed out in the quote of George Macdonald and as Eaglesway has mentioned in His post, that Jesus was being measured up by who He is and who He is not. I believe there was a trial taking place in the New Testament between the false gods of the world and the one true God. We are to be the judges. The false gods( leaders of Israel) were the ones who declared Jesus a sinner because He did not follow their man -made doctrines and corrupt laws, and so they sentenced Him to death on the cross. However, the one true God saves. He is compassionate, full of love, forgiveness, truth and mercy etc. etc. Who do we want to follow?
IMO no one’s name is written in “heaven” until they are “in Christ”. The salvation of all is guaranteed because God has said He will do it and Christ has already done the work, so even tho "As in Adam all died so also in Christ shall all be made alive… it is each in his own order. Those who are in Adam are still “dead”. They are not a part of “the general assembly of the firstborn registered in heaven” (Heb 12)
The “called out ones” are a “kind of firstfruits of God’s (new) creation.” The first fruits of the harvest have been gathered, the rest of the harvest is still in the field.
The fact that there is a college fund for you does you no good if you dont go. If you do go you will not receive the full benefit of a degree unless you graduate. A person with a college fund is not a graduate.
“To all those who received Him He gave the “right” to become children of God.” As all things are being gathered into one in Christ according to God’s plan, they are not in Christ until they are gathered, over the dispensation of the fulness of times. As each adversary is subjected and gathered, unto the last, they will come into Christ and the general assembly of the firstborn registered in heaven.
Hi Jeff, thanks for the answer(s) I would like to make a couple of comments…
You said:
To be honest, I don’t remember bringing this up. So I hope that I am not guilty of such.
But, you said:
Okay,
Then you said:
I’m not sure where this 'dimension ’ comes from. Are you referring to the ‘spiritual’ verses the ‘temporal’? I assume so because you use the term ‘temporal dimension’.
You also said:
Once again I don/t recall saying this.
But you go on to say
I may be wrong, but it seems you want to believe that Christ has atoned for the sin of all humanity, but seem to sugest that God will somehow punish them for their unbelief.
You said:
Now Jeff, this is the same Christ that tells the multitude to love their enemies, ate and drank with sinners, healed the sick and lame.
I guess I see service /belief as an honor in this life, not as a requirement. It seems like anyone who does not believe your way, is doomed to a life of misery.
What say you?