The Evangelical Universalist Forum

How To Live Under An Unqualified President by John Piper

But what if God does want the USA to be predominant, in other words to some a ‘nationalism’ mentality, for the betterment of the world, would this be bad?

That’s fine with me. The “nationalism” I find ungodly insists on putting one’s own self- interests above any other interests in the world.

Time to eat my Cheerios (or Aldi’s / Trader Joes’ store equivalent), drink my coffee or tea.

And see what’s in, the BBC news today! :wink:

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6 questions for impeachment lovers:

  1. Should Joe Biden be immune from consequence if, as suspected, he threatened to withhold aid to Ukraine to enforce his demand to remove the prosecutor investigating his son’s Ukrainian company?
  2. Assuming you answered, “no,” to the first question, what’s wrong with the president asking Ukraine to cooperate in any DoJ investigation of the apparent pay-for-play Biden/Ukraine scandal?
  3. What “crime” did Trump commit by asking Ukraine to look into the Bidens’ Ukraine shenanigans?
  4. With an election in November 2020, why not instead skip the trial in the Senate and use the electoral process to deny Trump the 2nd term?
  5. Why is Adam Schiff in charge?
    Representative Adam Schiff chairs the Intelligence Committee. The Washington Post recently awarded Schiff four Pinocchios in a fact check of his claim that he did not coordinate with the whistleblower before he filed his complaint. He also claimed to have seen direct evidence of the Trump/Russia Collusion that never materialized.
    6.Why isn’t the House following the Nixon and Clinton precedents?

Zealous impeachers have not, in all my armchairing investigations, had any good answers to any of those 6 questions.
Of course, when I say ‘good’ answers, I mean straightforward truthful unparsed answers.

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Randy! I can’t believe it!! The BBC actually ran a story positive about Trump:

“Brutal impeachment numbers for Dems in new Monmouth poll: 73% have little/no trust in process, 60% say Dems are more interested in destroying Trump than finding facts, 51% oppose impeachment, only 37% say Trump’s actions are clear grounds for impeachment.”
My bad - that was RealClearPolitics. Shoulda known…

What’s at stake as the evidence is publicly presented next week:

That is quite sad, Bob… This means 3/4 are for it. Without seeing the evidence. Not sure how anyone can support impeachment yet, besides a select few people. But I could see 3/4 being ok with opening a fair investigation.

That is actually an idictment of our public. Lol, srsly, 3/4 have their mind made up! Let’s not confuse these people with future facts that might get in the way of their mind being made up!

I think those figures are way overblown, but polls are what they are - anything but unbiased.
I think that like in the last elections, where all the polls were so very wrong - utterly wrong - we need to keep in mind that the american people are smarter than the political party.

No!! That’s not the finding. The proportion on each side who’ve already made their mind up is similar. Just as many have decided the facts prove nothing was impeachable, as believe the opposite.

But if your point is that neither verdict should be embraced in such a partisan manner without waiting to see all the evidence, I completely agree. And my point in posting this, was to salute the significant reality that at least some folk haven’t done that, and remain a bellwether and politically significant force.

Indeed, that was my point.

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So how would putting yourself (and family) interest, ‘In a national way’ be ungodly?

Because if we give no place to the interests of others beyond ourself, we reject the divine reality that God is not a nationalist, and loves those in every nation.
So my bias is that nations will get along better by conveying that they care about the others’ interests, even as they put a premium on taking care of their own.

So: if you’re American, America first. If you’re Australian, Australia first! That makes a ton of sense.
By saying ‘First’ we are not implying hatred for other peoples - we are just saying we need to take care of our own ‘first’.
We need to be tough; we need to be caring as well. There’s no real conflict between the two, as long as we remember our priorities.

I agree; that’s well put, and what I meant by “putting a premium on taking care of our own.”

Yet as I suggested, my perception is that some versions of ‘nationalism’ convey that we only really care about our own, putting self-interest “above all other interests” among nations.

So my bias is that sometimes historically, and now in the present era, the unwillingness to join in what meets others’ interests, and appearing to selfishly seek only our own enrichment, has sowed the seeds of much distrust among nations, that often leads to conflict. I hope I’m wrong, but my view is that perceptions of this me first ethos will lead to suffering exacerbated conflicts down the road internationally, as well as more polarized conflict within our own nation.

Time to start my day, with the BBC online news! :crazy_face:

Trump impeachment: What you might have missed

BBC must have missed this one too?

Your conclusions are incredibly biased like “rush to bury the transcript” and “hide” that conversation in a secret server? Where do you get your info from CNN or MSNBC or all the leftist stations?
It was not a secret server, it was used many times by Obama with no comments by anybody. One purpose of transcripts being stored there was because transcripts of many early Trump calls were leaked to the NY Times & Wash Post and this server uses codes to prevent this.

The only quid pro I have seen is one where you have to add imaginary words to the transcript that you wish were there.

This impeachment is a scam. Everyone knows that.