The Evangelical Universalist Forum

List of those of who reject traditional hellism

Evangelical Universalism
#81

“If you have to use the fear of hell to get people into the Kingdom, then in a sense, doesn’t hell become your “gospel”? If hell is the most powerful motivating factor for getting people saved, then I say that those people are not really saved after all because they are only being manipulated into something out of fear and duty, not love, faith, and desire” (Raising Hell: Christianity’s Most Controversial Doctrine Put Under Fire, pg. 36).

“…[O]ne day I realized that, if Hell is really true, and God is actually losing most of his creation to evil and darkness, you could say that good is overcome, and darkness overtakes light. Ultimately, Satan wins the tug-of-war over creation, and God loses. What a terrifying thought - how did I ever get through life with such a fatalistic view?” (Raising Hell: Christianity’s Most Controversial Doctrine Put Under Fire, pg. 57).

“What child in the world would ever believe (without adult influence) that a loving parent would create a fearful place of torment, and then endlessly abandon His children there to punish them in response to a limited duration of unbelief or rebellion, or for choices made from ignorance, distortions, deceptions, or bad influences? My educated, reasoned belief is zero” (Raising Hell: Christianity’s Most Controversial Doctrine Put Under Fire, pg. 6).

(I asked for her birth year just now)

Julie Ferwerda is recognized for making the Bible exciting and relevant to everyday life through her writing. She has authored several inspirational books and articles, helping people of all ages along their faith journey. Learn more at JulieFerwerda.com or RaisingHellBook.com.

#82

The wonderful Adin Ballou (1803-1890) needs a quote:

**Of his intense mystical experience and final acceptance of Universalism: **

“My faith was conclusively sealed, and I have never since felt one serious doubt of the final universal holiness and happiness of all the immortal children of God.”
— Ballou, A (1886), ‘Autobiography of Adin Ballou’, p.84, The Vox Populi Press, Massachusetts

Of his Universalist faith amongst his critics:

“I was a sincere, firm, devoted believer in the doctrine of the final universal holiness and happiness for the entire human race. That doctrine was sacred to me as the apple of my eye. I could not deny it, hide it under a bushel, nor in any way ignore it. To me it involved everything in theology and ethics worth preaching and living for…”
— Ballou, A (1886), ‘Autobiography of Adin Ballou’, p.176, The Vox Populi Press, Massachusetts

Of his beliefs informing his abolitionism (and more generally, his socialist and pacifist activism):

“My own avowed religious principles and ideas – the universal fatherhood of God, the universal brotherhood of men, the all-redeeming grace of Christ, the final redemption of all men – these all, in their practical application, tendencies, and results, not only suggested, but required, necessitated the course I felt myself sacredly bound to pursue.”
— Ballou, A (1886), ‘Autobiography of Adin Ballou’, p.332, The Vox Populi Press, Massachusetts

Of Christianity as the highest of religious sentiment:

“I firmly believe that Christianity, as taught and exemplified by Jesus Christ and his apostles, is not only the highest and best religion ever promulgated to mankind, but, in its declared essentials, the one true and absolute religion, indispensable to the perfect holiness and happiness of the human race, and destined to final universal acceptance.”
— Ballou, A (1870) ‘Primitive Christianity and its corruptions’, Volume 1, p.III, Universalist Publishing House, Boston

#83

I haven’t been able to find a birth or death date from him (he may still be alive), but for the Convinced Universalist category…

Hryniewicz, Waclaw: influential Polish Roman Catholic theologian, converted from Eastern Orthodoxy, served as head of the Ecumenical Institute of the Catholic University of Lublin.

Some quotes offhand from The Challenge of Our Hope (I haven’t read the whole book yet):

“The Bible predicts the ultimate transfiguration of the world and tells us to expect it. Thus it gives hope for the fulfillment of permanent human yearning for the prevalence of the good in the whole of creation. There is in this promise a breath of truly divine universalism with regard to the destiny of humanity, the Earth and the entire Universe.” (introduction)

“I believe and trust that one day [God] will draw all people to Himself, purified, transfigured and reconciled. …] This is real history, maturing in order to gain ultimate fulfillment. God will accept it into His own history. It is this which is so amazing! Without it, the Christian view of the future would be much too shortsighted, deprived of spiritual depth and truly divine universalism.” (introduction)

"Christianity is not a religion of transcendental egoism and exclusive concern for personal salvation, but a faith inseparable from love, compassion and hope for universal salvation. This is why Christians with their hope for the coming of the Kingdom of God are able to initiate a dialogue with those who put forward an ideal of building a better future for all humankind, more worthy of rational beings. (chapter 1)

“This ideal vision [of the anthropological ideal to live with all and for all, not only to live for oneself or for a selected group of others out of the total] is by no means at odds with Christian teaching. It does not impair Christianity’s most far-reaching objective – hope for universal salvation.” (chp 1)

“How else can God’s universal Reign be understood? It is in this Reign that the dramatic gift of freedom, this most magnificent capacity of our lives, may be finally fulfilled. One who speaks of hope for universal salvation awaits with confidence universal reconciliation, definitive victory of goodness, and ultimate harmony of the world. In God’s eyes only what is good is worthy of salvation and final fulfilment. Eternity neither absorbs nor destroys temporal reality, but thoroughly purifies and transforms it before admitting it into the eternal life of the Creator of the Universe. This explains why Christian hope speaks about the ultimate salvation of the world’s history—of the past history of all created beings. Death is no obstacle in this respect… God will have the final say. He makes it possible that the ultimate fulfilment of the ideal of universal reconciliation may come true.” (chp 1)

#84

Excellent! I had found an interesting bio site several months ago, but couldn’t find it again yesterday. :frowning:

#85

Does anyone know Keith Ward’s position? (i’ve put him under convinced, but i need a clear quote)

And Brad Jersak, or Archbishop Lazar Phalo? And Frank Schaeffer? (And any of the other Hellbound interviewees)? I’m finding it hard to track down clear opinions and clear quotes from some of these people … I can’t even find a clear quote from Kevin Miller, and I’m fairly sure he’s a universalist of some sort … help!

#86

I think only people with admin powers can sticky threads in most places. I’ll ping [tag]Alex Smith[/tag]. I expect he or [tag]SLJ[/tag] or one of the other admins will agree this is well worth stickying. :slight_smile:

#87

Stickied :ugeek:

Great initiative Pog, sorry I hadn’t stickied it sooner!

#88

From three wonderful Anabaptists:

Vernard Eller (1927-2007) is a hopeful universalist. Brethren theologian and Christian anarchist.

“I think it would be wrong to come out dogmatically, saying that John [of Patmos] teaches that all men eventually will be saved. That would be to go further than the evidence allows… it would be wrong to assert that he teaches that all men will be saved, just as wrong would it be to assert that he teaches that some men never can be saved; he doesn’t say that, either! As much as we can say with confidence, then, is that John teaches that we dare never deny the possibility of any person’s being saved — if “the kings of the earth” can find their way to redemption, then it’s a possibility for anyone! Don’t ever say that you know for a fact what is the ultimate destiny of any man — be he Adolf Hitler, Cain, or Judas Iscariot. We dare not be dogmatic as to what God will do — whether save all or only some. But even more, we dare not suggest that God is limited in what he can do. Who are we to say how many people or which people God in his love and grace will be able to get to and win? Who are we to say that, at some point, God quits loving people and working for their redemption, the redemption for which he gave his only Son? No, John does not make a universalistic claim about what God will do; but neither is he willing to make a dogmatic assertion about what God will not do. What we can and must say is that John attributes to and leaves with God ‘the universalistic possibility’.”
— Eller, V (1974) ‘The most revealing book in the Bible’, p.204, Eerdmans Publishing Company, Grand Rapids

Jacques Ellul (1912-1994) is a hopeful and convinced universalist (wasn’t an Anabaptist exactly, but he did identify with them). Noted philosopher, sociologist, professor of law, lay-theologian, Christian anarchist and all-round genius.

“Although I proclaim the truth of universal salvation, I cannot proclaim it as an absolute truth. I cannot penetrate the secret of God. I cannot presume upon a simple decision of the eternal Father. Hence I cannot proclaim this truth as a dogmatic proposition which is scientifically demonstrated. In proclaiming it, I am saying what I believe, what meditation on the biblical texts leads me to believe. I do not teach universal salvation; I announce it.”
— Ellul, J (1989) ‘What I believe’, p.207, Eerdmans Publishing Company, Grand Rapids

Anthony Buzzard (1935-Present) is an annihilationist (Sir Anthony Buzzard if we’re a respecter of titles). Socinian/unitarian Bible scholar and professor at Atlanta Bible College.

I’ve read a fair bit of his stuff and after hours of looking, I couldn’t find a good quote that encapsulates his view of annihilationism. Sorry! He does quote Dr. William Temple (1882-1944), Archbishop of Canterbury, (if one wanted to look into this further; I’m trying to keep to primary references myself): “One thing we can say with confidence: everlasting torment is to be ruled out. If men had not imported the Greek and unbiblical notion of the natural indestructibility of the individual soul, and then read the New Testament with that in their minds, they would have drawn from it a belief, not in everlasting torment, but in annihilation” [Christian Faith and Life, London: SCM Press, p. 81] read in Buzzard, A (1986) ‘What happens when we die?’, p.61, Atlanta Bible College, Atlanta

#89

You won’t get much from John Howard Yoder (if this is whom you meant by “John Yoder”?). Yoder avoided dogmatic eschatological claims (regarding heaven and hell) and was greatly committed to libertarian free will. I did a search and found this quote:

“Just as the doctrine of creation affirms that God made us free and the doctrine of redemption says that this freedom of sin was what led agape to the cross, the doctrine of hell lets sin free, finally and irrevocably, to choose separation from God. Only by respecting this freedom to the bitter end can love give meaning to history. Any universalism that would seek, in the intention of magnifying redemption, to deny the unrepentant sinner the liberty to refuse God’s grace would in reality deny that human choice has any meaning at all.”
—Yoder, YH (1994) ‘The Royal Priesthood’, Herald Press, p.151

Bonhoeffer made some pretty universalistic sentiments, but I doubt he was a convinced universalist. Like Yoder, he greatly emphasised the importance of our choices. I’m not an expert on him (or any other of these guys) though. I’ll try and have a look a bit later.

#90

Pog and others,

Read over the up to date list yesterday of names and quotes and was very encouraged. You’ve done a great job. I’m looking forward to reading more that David Congdon has to say. His blog is here: fireandrose.blogspot.com/

Did want to point out that his name is misspelled in the list.

#91

Jason, (if you’re reading this)

Have you read Congdon’s series on his blog: Why I am a Universalist? He reminds me of some of your writing, and I think you really enjoy what he has to say. He gets into the atonement and the Trinity and is a big Barth afficionado. I’m intrigued by his Barthian idea of the atonement though I don’t completely understand it as Congdon is pretty heady. Anyways, just wanted to pass that along.

Caleb

#92

I’ve read him a little and keep meaning to read more; I remembered to bookmark him this time. :slight_smile:

I disagree with his eglatarian concept of the Trinity on ontological grounds, which is kind of ironic since he rightly appeals to the ontological reality of God instead of natural social analogies. But this is not the place to chew over that.

#93

Bulgakov goes all in in the final chapter of his theological trilogy On Divine Humanity, specifically chapter 8 of The Bride of the Lamb, published posthumously in 1945.

Bulgakov, Sergius (1871-1944), leading Russian Orthodox systematic theologian of the 20th century, dean and professor of dogmatic theology at Saint Sergius Theological Institute in Paris for 20 years until his death.

“It is a bizarre conception of the parousia to limit its power to a judgment whereby heaven and hell are separated and hell is eternalized. What virtue and justification would the parousia have if part of humanity turns out to be unprepared for it? In that case, the parousia would not attain its goal, or it would even attain the opposite: the establishment of an eternal hell. But does this justify the parousia? A separation can be accepted only if, in the final analysis, it nonetheless attains the goal of the universal salvation or the sophianization [indwelling acceptance of and free cooperation with the Holy Spirit, God being “all in all”] of creation. Otherwise, creation would appear to be an error or failure, since it would end with the eternity of hell [even in annihilation of the sinner out of existence], even if this were accompanied by the eternity of heaven. An eternal separation of humanity into the elect and the reprobate is clearly not the final meaning of creation. One must therefore suppose this separation has an inner proportionality of grace that assures a positive final sum of all the pluses and minuses of history, a universal harmony, total and beautiful. In other words, the judgment that separates the sheep from the goats and good from evil, both in humankind in its entirety and in individual hearts, is not the definitive conclusion of eschatology. It is only the first event of eschatology, the beginning, not the end. Both the judgment and the separation must be understood not as a static unchangeability but as a dynamic striving beyond their limits, on the pathways to universal deification or salvation. Only deification is capable of justifying creation. It is the only theodicy. …] This pathway can end only with the filling of the void that appeared in heaven as a consequence of the fall, [eve] with the return of the fallen angels, the ‘lost sheep’, to the fullness of the kingdom of God, where God is definitively all in all without any limitation or exception, and creation is without any failure or even minus: ‘He shall have put down all rule and all authority and power. For he must reign till he hath put all enemies under his feet.’”

#94

St. Isaac the Syrian aka Isaac the Seer (500s), Syrian expatriate monk of Italy, famous for humility, charity, compassion, evangelical conversion of those who sought to cheat or rob him, and his gift of clairvoyance, also for his visions of the coming judgment. “[The loving, pitying heart] is a blazing up of the human heart with regard to all creation, with regard to people, birds, animals, demons, and all creatures. By a great and powerful pity that embraces the heart, by a great patience, the human heart becomes a loving or pitying one, and it cannot tolerate or hear or see any harm or any small pain endured by creatures. And also for wordless beings and for enemies of truth, and for those who do him harm, such a one continuously prays with tears that they be safeguarded and that mercy be granted to them. And for creatures that creep upon the earth he prays with great compassion, which is excited in his heart without measure, until [within him] there is a likening in this to God. …] By its power love affects human beings in a twofold manner: it torments sinners, as even here a friend sometimes causes one to suffer, and it gladdens those who have carried out their duty. And so, in my opinion, the torment of Gehenna consists in repentance.” Ascetic Discourses, 3rd edition of Russian translation, pp 19, 253-54.

#95

Pog,

You still need to correct the spelling for David Congdon’s last name.

Thanks for all the work you’ve done. Awesome list!

Caleb

#96

Hi pog, hi everybody who’s contributing to this fantastic thread.

Can I make a pitch for my favourite modern theologian, Robert Farrar Capon. If you take him at his word I guess you’d have to classify him as ‘hopeful’. But in reality, based on the consistent themes in his writing of God’s ultimate triumph over evil and, particularly, the Biblical metaphor of the eternally open gates of the New Jerusalem, I reckon he’s actually more convinced than he’s prepared to let on. So:

**Farrar Capon, Robert (1925 - **) American Episcopalian priest, author of The Supper of the Lamb, Between Noon and Three and many other theological books.

"I am and I am not a universalist. I am one if you are talking about what God in Christ has done to save the world. The Lamb of God has not taken away the sins of some — of only the good, or the cooperative, or the select few who can manage to get their act together and die as perfect peaches. He has taken away the sins of the world — of every last being in it — and he has dropped them down the black hole of Jesus’ death. On the cross, he has shut up forever on the subject of guilt: “There is therefore now no condemnation. . . .” All human beings, at all times and places, are home free whether they know it or not, feel it or not, believe it or not.

“But I am not a universalist if you are talking about what people may do about accepting that happy-go-lucky gift of God’s grace. I take with utter seriousness everything that Jesus had to say about hell, including the eternal torment that such a foolish non-acceptance of his already-given acceptance must entail. All theologians who hold Scripture to be the Word of God must inevitably include in their work a tractate on hell. But I will not — because Jesus did not — locate hell outside the realm of grace. Grace is forever sovereign, even in Jesus’ parables of judgment. No one is ever kicked out at the end of those parables who wasn’t included in at the beginning.”

We’ve discussed Capon before, and I recall Sherman saying he thought he sounded Arminian. Which of course he does. I’m an Arminian Universalist myself! But the big difference between orthodox, eternal damnation Arminianism as espoused by, say, CS Lewis, which teaches that it is possible for us to damn ourselves irrevocably through our fixed rejection of God, and Arminian Universalism is that the latter holds that the door to true repentance remains genuinely open for all eternity - thus offering perpetual hope of salvation for everyone.

What do you guys think?

Johnny

#97

I agree that anyone in the disputed category should have an explanation appended.

#98

Btw, St. Therese inspired the Catholic mystic Adrienne von Spyer, who in turn worked closely with her spiritual advisor Hans Urs Von Balthasar (who references St. Therese in Love Alone Is Credible, one of his books for which he had to write a defense in Dare We Hope That All Men Be Saved?)

Catholic publisher Ignatius features several books and DVDs directly about Therese, and many others which refer to her; the 100th anniversary documentary of her life for example (there are several dramatic films as well), and The Message of St. Therese of Lisieux which collects her teachings in five small pamphlets. Her teachings were applied along with those of several other proponents of divine mercy in a well-regarded “spiritual retreat” manual, Consoling the Heart of Jesus.

I don’t know where or if the drama she herself wrote (mentioned by Sobor) is available anywhere.

Incidentally, on a hunch I looked up St. Faustina Kowalska, one of the sources gathered with St. Therese in the spiritual retreat manual; she was the first Roman Catholic saint recognized in the 21st century, and had had her visions and diary of Jesus suppressed by the papal office (which she had predicted would happen, or which Jesus had told her would happen) for about 25 years, before she was investigated and eventually petitioned for unbanning by Archbishop Karol Wojtyla – soon to be Pope John Paul 2! Thanks to his promotion of her, her focus (reportedly directed by Jesus) on “Divine Mercy” has been greatly advanced, and the RCC now celebrates Divine Mercy Sunday as the first Sunday after Easter–she has a direct following of at least 100 million devotees, and is sometimes even known today as “The Apostle of Mercy”! JP2’s successor, Benedict 16, instituted a World Apostolic Conference on Divine Mercy in 2008, and issued a Mandate on the Divine Mercy in 2009. (Which although I haven’t read it yet reportedly contains some “stunning” statements (as the publisher puts it) on how even Judas’ betrayal reveals God’s mercy.)

I have a suspicion from the confluence of notable universalists and near universalists involved here, that she was also a Christian universalist. Her 700 page collection of diary entries can be found attached at the new thread I created for discussing her (so we don’t get too bird-dogged on this thread), but I’ll attach it here, too, for ease of reference.
St. Faustina-Divine Mercy in my Soul.pdf (1.55 MB)

#99

Hi Jason –

Now that’s a really interesting line of transmission :slight_smile:

See here for more information about this particular nativity play

romancatholicism.org/therese.htm

Therese’s plays are available to subscribers of Project Muse here:

muse.jhu.edu/journals/cat/summar … ckert.html

#100

Btw, Isaac the Syrian Seer is a different St. Isaac than Isaac the Syrian from Ninevah. Both appear to have been universalists, although Isaac of Ninevah is more famous for it, being a chief hymnist for the Eastern Orthodox. Isaac the Seer is more venerated in the Roman Church, having worked in Italy; he should at least be categorized as a post-mortem salvationist, maybe a hopeful universalist along Balthasar’s line.