Luke 2:14 Peace to whom???

[KelliKae]

I have been thinking about the words the heavenly host sang out at Jesus’ birth. I am frustrated though at the different ways they are translated. Below are the first several from Biblios. Why do some announce peace and good will to all men and others only to “those with whom he is pleased”? I don’t know the Greek word endings and grammar well enough to understand which translation is most proper. And the English can be subtle. Can someone help me?

These words seem so hopeful, unless of course, they are only just for a few.

Kelli

New International Version (©1984)
“Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace to men on whom his favor rests.”

New Living Translation (©2007)
“Glory to God in highest heaven, and peace on earth to those with whom God is pleased.”

English Standard Version (©2001)
“Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace among those with whom he is pleased!”

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
“Glory to God in the highest, And on earth peace among men with whom He is pleased.”

Holman Christian Standard Bible (©2009)
Glory to God in the highest heaven, and peace on earth to people He favors!

International Standard Version (©2012)
“Glory to God in the highest, and peace on earth to people who enjoy his favor!”

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace, good will toward men.

Aramaic Bible in Plain English (©2010)
“Glory to God in Heaven, and upon earth peace, Good News to the children of men.”

[Cindy_Skillman]

Here are the literal translations (or at least the ones I have access to):

Glory to God among the Highest! And on earth peace, Among men, delight!" (Luk 2:14 CLV)

‘Glory in the highest to God, and upon earth peace, among men – good will.’ (Luk 2:14 RYLT-NT)

“[This is] a reputation for God, in the highest places! (or: Glory to God, in the midst of the highest [realms]; or: [It is] a manifestation which call forth praise to God, among the highest [peoples]; or: An appearance and a manifestation by God, within the midst of a most elevated location; or: A notion and an imagination within [the] highest places in God); and upon earth – among humanity (or: within mankind) – a peace and harmony having the qualities and characteristics of well-thinking (or: = shalom] whose source is good opinions and imaginations of well-being; or: peace which is a manifestation and a reputation of good and ease; or: a peace which belongs to good pleasure)!” (Luk 2:14 JM-NT)

Glory to God in the highest and peace on earth, in men-- good-pleasure. (Luk 2:14 MLV)

Glory, in the highest, unto God! And, on earth, peace, among men of goodwill. (Luk 2:14 Rotherham)

Glory to God in the highest, and peace on earth, good will among men. (Luk 2:14 LITV)

And here are some from versions which tend more toward literal translation, as far as I can see . . .

Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace and good hope for men. (Luk 2:14 Lamsa NT)

Glory in highest heavens to God, and on earth peace; among men good will. (Luk 2:14 Diaglott-NT)

“Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace, goodwill toward men!” (Luk 2:14 EMTV)

Glory to God Elohim in the highest highests ,
and on earth peace shalom ,
good will well-approval toward men humanity . (Luk 2:14 ERRB)

Best I can do, since I’m not a student of Greek. I kind of have to rely on various resources, and these are ambiguous as to how this passage should be translated. As you can see, the literalists seem to think it should be translated “goodwill toward men” or similar. Apparently the damnationalists saw this verse as a problem and said, “Oh, well . . . it COULD be translated this other way, and that must be right because how could God announce good will toward ALL men?”

Maybe Jason will pick up on this. Maybe I’ll send him a note. It’s a good question.

Love you Sis,
Cindy

[Username1]

Hi guys

Robert Young, in his highly respected literal translation, translates this verse as follows:

“Glory in the highest to God, and upon earth peace, among men – goodwill.”

As far as I can tell, the Greek word translated as “goodwill”, or alternatively “with whom he is pleased”, is in the noun form. This suggests to me that the “to all men translation” is the more accurate.

I agree with Cindy that this very much appears to be one of the numerous examples of translators bringing their own prejudices to the text. Sadly, it seems like some people just don’t want the good news to apply to all of us!

Cheers

Johnny

[KelliKae]

A friend sent this link to me via Facebook: en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annuncia … #section_2, which is addressing the disparity between Christmas carols and what the Bible says.

Translational issues

The King James Version of the Bible translates the words of the angels differently from modern versions, using the words “Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace, good will toward men”[3] (where the word “men” is used generically to mean “people” or “human beings”). Most Christmas carols reflect this older translation, with It Came Upon the Midnight Clear, for example, using the words “Peace on the earth, good will to men, / From Heaven’s all gracious King.”

The disparity reflects a dispute about the Greek text of the New Testament involving a single letter.[4] The Greek text accepted by most modern scholars today[5][6] uses the words epi gēs eirēnē en anthrōpois eudokias (ἐπὶ γῆς εἰρήνη ἐν ἀνθρώποις εὐδοκίας),[7] literally “on earth peace to men of good will,” with the last word being in the genitive case[6] (apparently reflecting a Semitic idiom that reads strangely in Greek[6]). Most ancient manuscripts of the Greek New Testament have this reading. The original version of the ancient Codex Sinaiticus (denoted ℵ* by scholars[7][8]) has this reading,[5] but it has been altered by erasure of the last letter[4][9] to epi gēs eirēnē en anthrōpois eudokia (ἐπὶ γῆς εἰρήνη ἐν ἀνθρώποις εὐδοκία), literally “on earth (first subject: peace) to men (second subject: good will),” with two subjects in the nominative case.[6] Expressed in correct English, this gives the familiar “Peace on earth, good will to men” of many ancient Christmas carols.

According to this, “most modern scholars” believe eudokias to be in the genitive case, making it “of good will”. I guess I should look up that reference in Wikipedia and find out who the modern scholars are.

Does anyone know about the Codex Sinaiticus?

[KelliKae]

Okay, so this is really cool:

codexsinaiticus.org/en/manuscrip … omSlider=0

You can actually see a “photo” of the page and the word. If you click on the word in blue (in the right column), the word in the codex is boxed in red. The Wikipedia article said that the last letter of the word has been erased. So, here are my questions:

Why was it erased?
Who erased it?

Because most of the early manuscripts have the genitive case of this word, should I dismiss the idea that this verse is a promise of good will to ALL men?

[pilgrim]

Hi Kellikee
I looked into this some time ago and if I recall correctly:
Our older English texts were based on the manuscripts we had which were copies written long after the originals. They are best translated:
“peace and goodwill to (all) men”
We have since (dead-sea scrols) found more reliable manuscripts, written nearer the time of the original, and they are best translated:
“peace to men of goodwill”.
Yes it all revolves around the ending of that one Greek word and whether the case-ending is genitive.
I concluded that the most reliable reading is “Peace to men of goodwill” even though I was wanting it to be the other.

God bless and I hope this helps.

[KelliKae]

Thanks, everyone.
I am not completely satisfied–I probably won’t be till I learn Greek. = )
But for now I will reluctantly give up this bit of hope.

Kelli

[Lizabeth]

“men on whom His favor rests”, even if it is the correct translation could still mean all men—what man can say His favor isn’t for everybody? Wasn’t that kind of the point of the Incarnation? And eventually all humankind will be of goodwill in Christ.

And the angels would have been singing in Hebrew if they were singing to Jewish shepherds–not Greek. And what witness did Luke talk to about this passage anyway? I think we of the CEU belief are free to interpret this passage in the “goodwill towards men” way.

Actually, I think its interesting that most of the Christmas hyms are quite universalist. Maybe more truth comes out in music than in plain words.

[Username1]

Good points Lizabeth.

Don’t lose heart, Kelli. One single verse, with a highly contentious translation, makes little material difference one way or the other. And in the ‘worst case scenario’, even if this verse does indeed mean “peace to all men of goodwill”, does that really speak against EU? Could it be that there cannot be peace to men as long as they remain of ill will, that there must be a struggle until they truly become children of God?

And do the gospels not proclaim good news for ALL people?

Peace and love

Johnny

[KelliKae]

Thanks, Johnny,

I won’t let this one setback dash my hopeful universalism. I agree with Lizabeth that there is still room for much hope in that verse.

[JasonPratt]

Paidion and I had a brief debate about the translation, last year around this time.

Our portion of the thread starts here.

We both agreed that the translation reported by Davidbo as part of a kids Christmas play he attended, “peace on earth to those who believe”, was ultra-wrong.

Back in 2010 I wrote a Christmas sermon where I came down on the side of “peace among men of His delight”, and still managed to unpack it in a way consonant with Christian universalism; Paidion’s correction to “peace among men of good will” (or “well-being among people of good will”, rather) certainly doesn’t hurt that result.

What we didn’t really cover last year was whether {eudokias} (the genitive form of the adjective, which we both agreed text-critical evidence indicated was original to the text) means “good report” or “delight” or “good will” or what exactly.

Knoch’s Concordant Literal translation, as well as the New American Standard, render it as “of His delight” (the former) or “with whom He is pleased” (the latter), neither of which is quite the same concept as “good will” or “good praise” or “good report” or even “good will”.

The spread of usage throughout the New Testament differs that widely, though.