I would argue that being loving IS proclaiming the gospel. Wasn’t it George Mueller (A giant of the faith, by any standard) who said, “Preach the gospel every day, and use words if you have to.” ?
I think it was Saint Francis of Assisi that said that?? I know what you are saying though, and love is the most important thing, but at some point the gospel needs to be spoken. The Philippian jailer said, “what must I do to be saved?” in response to an amazing act of love by the disciples and they led him to Christ, but it isn’t usually that simple. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not a shout it from the rooftop kind of guy. In fact, I tend to be much too timid and don’t tell people enough about Jesus. But the scriptures do say something like, “how can they know unless they hear, and how can they hear unless someone preaches…” or something like that. And then there is Jesus, “Go you therefore to all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the father…” You can’t preach the gospel without love, but people do need to hear that Jesus died for their sins. I think that one is pretty clear.
I’m like you on this one. I won’t tell someone about Christ unless I’ve gotten to know them a bit. It has to be relational and natural for me. I HATE “door to door” and stuff like that. It only makes people hostile about 99 percent of the time, and the other 1% really wish you weren’t bothering them even though they are being nice about it (I did Evangelism Explosion training once upon a time and it was a nightmare for me! 
) When I move somewhere new I usually don’t tell someone about my faith until after they get to know me. That way preconceived notions and stereotypes don’t get in the way.
With the street witnessing, the people know how the churches work on that. They know they have to “listen to the message” to get the food and I think that’s a HUGE mistake that the churches make. The love has to be genuine for it to impact someone like the Philippian jailer (what must I do to be saved?) I’m struggling right now trying to find a balance with witnessing. I don’t do it enough - I definitely have passed opportunities by because of shyness, but I don’t think God gives us a pass when we are shy 
It would be easy to fall into a “God will take care of them” attitude and I think that’s the wrong place to be. God still uses us, the body of Christ.
I wouldn’t worry about it too much, Chris. I have a girlfriend who would walk into the middle of a frat party and scream “WHO WANTS TO KNOW ABOUT JESUS?!” This is HER GIFT. She doesn’t CARE! She will speak her mind no matter WHAT! However, it’s just her personality, she’s like that no matter what the topic is and it gets her into trouble a lot! She is built for that, I am not and I don’t think God made a mistake making us the way he did. He matches me up with the people He wants me to share with…THAT’S IT. And I’ve seen amazing things come of it. 
1Pe_3:15 But sanctify the Lord God in your hearts: and be ready always to give an answer to every man that ASKETH YOU a reason of the hope that is in you with meekness and fear.
Dirtboy said:
So I’ve been pondering . . . what precisely was the gospel preached by Paul and the other apostles?
God is better than you think He is. (Or as John put it, “This is the gospel: God is light and in Him is no darkness at all!”)
Which is still a judgment on sin. But it’s also still a gospel even when being a judgment on sin.
Jesus, quoting Isaiah, “The Spirit of the Lord is upon Me;
for this reason He anoints Me: to preach the good news to the poor!
He has commissioned and sent Me to herald a pardon to captives whose hearts are contrite,
healing them, and promising recovery of sight to the blind!
–to send free with a pardon those captives who have become crushed!
–to proclaim the year of acceptance and favor, of the Lord!”
And what He preached in Galilee (adds the Follower)–after leaving Nazareth (adds the Disciple)–was: “The time is now fulfilled; the kingdom of God is near! Commit to doing better (repent), and trust in this good news!”
It’s funny you ask that because my wife and I have been discussing this. When Jesus and the disciples were preaching before his death and resurrection, the disciples didn’t even understand the resurrection yet so they were not yet preaching the resurrection from the dead. Not that it was a different gospel, just not complete yet. In the book of acts they preached the resurrection, big time and faith in Jesus “believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved, you and your household.”.
I agree with this 100%.
I wonder . . . it seems difficult to me for the apostles to preach the gospel to Greeks who knew nothing of Jewish culture. Maybe that’s one reason Paul always started at the local synagogue? The thing about “to the Jews first and also to the Gentiles,” I know, but there would be “God fearing” Gentiles there, too. At any rate, the people would have a background, would be expecting Messiah, and would see His proclamation as good news. And then these folks could be a link to the Gentile world which they understood better than any Jew probably could.
On Mars Hill, Paul used the Greeks’ own cultural references, and even though he didn’t have a lot of success there (as we measure success), this sermon of his is perhaps an example for us to follow to some extent. Or maybe it was more a lesson to Paul of what not to do a second time, because later he says, “I determined to know nothing among you save Christ, and Him crucified.”
But what do we do now, in a culture which has been inoculated against what they see as Christianity? They think they know, and what they “know” is almost without exception poisonous. So it seems to me that UR is a necessary part of any successful gospel preaching we might do. As Jason says, God is better than we knew. And yet most of the believers you and I are acquainted with also believe firmly in at least Anni if not ECT. Many of them are never-the-less true believers – as far as I can tell.
It is these people who will, in large part, be preaching any gospel that gets preached. We can do our part, of course, but we are few. Are we to become many? I feel a bit reticent to take a chance on making the gospel about UR. I’m sure that’s far less than the whole, or even the main story, though I’m coming to believe that it is an indispensable component of it. God cannot be good if He does not redeem ALL of His own, and we are all His own. We know this not only because He says so, but also because He has put His own moral sense in us and we do know, at least on a macro scale, what is good and what is evil.
The lost/destroyed sheep also know this, and they rebel against a God who makes us the way we are and then punishes us for it – especially such a pointless, hopeless punishment as ECT. So perhaps it’s necessary, in order to counterbalance against former excesses on the side of the eternal hell doctrine, to “over-steer” a bit on the side of UR. Whatever we do, I know the gospel is not about a thing or a doctrine, but about Jesus coming in the flesh; the Messiah being given, His life, death, resurrection and ascension, and His gift of the Holy Spirit to everyone who believes, as they believe.
Sorry if none of this makes sense. I’m just musing aloud, really, and trying to see all of this in my spirit and understand just what the gospel He would like us to proclaim should taste like, look like, sound like. I’m positive it doesn’t taste anything like the four spiritual laws. That is immitation food to a people who are starving for genuine sustenance. Jesus is the bread of life. How do we give them Jesus in a 16 page graphic tract? I’m not sure that’s possible. But it has to be possible to at least give a sufficiently sustaining taste without laying out the entire bible in one go.
Love, Cindy
At church last Sunday I attended a class on other religions and what they believe. The approach really turned me off (the teacher is really into Walter Martin). There was very little mention of how to relate and love those who don’t believe, it was all aout how to win arguments against them. Did Jesus walk around refuting other peoples’ world views? Discuss amongst thyselves
Heh. Good point, roof.
Well, actually . . . I was about to say “no,” but then I thought about it a bit. Jesus did go around refuting the world views of the religious leaders of His day. He got pretty “in your face” about it, too. I would have been trying to be truthful but diplomatic, but He wasn’t worried about that. He just laid it right out there. The Pharisees and Sadducees and Priests were offended, as one would expect, and Jesus was just all right with that.
However, that said, as I’m not Jesus, I’m rather of the opinion that, at least for me, it’s better to love people as they are, and when they are, or become, open to the gospel, to allow them to see Jesus for themselves in whatever way He chooses to reveal Himself. And if we’re extra specially blessed, He might allow us to be involved in that process by following His instructions in serving these “pre-brothers” and “pre-sisters.” 
I think it’s helpful to have some knowledge of the more prominent belief systems in our circles, not so much to be able to argue against them, but just for the sake of understanding somewhat of where our friends and neighbors are coming from. After all, if you’re having a Muslim friend over for supper, it would be good to know not to serve shrimp or offer to shake with your left hand because you’re carrying something in your right. But for the sake of “proving” the other guy wrong? Waste of time. Not going to happen. People are pulled to the cross by Jesus, not driven there by Pharisees.
Love in Him, Cindy
Just my viewpoint:
I actually believe that there are atheists that DO believe…
and christians that do NOT believe.
“When… When did I do these things??”
versus
“Did I NOT do these things…??!”
If someone is following the path of love in any given moment, any given situation then they ARE following GOD, for God IS love.
Labels mean not a thing.
All of our labels will one day flutter to the ground…
It is the heart that matters. As evidenced by the above quotes.
I don’t normally see people in terms of what label they attach to theirselves. If they are following love, I see that they are “believers”. Those who are not believers, meaning those who are not practicing loving their neighbor as theirself… then that to me, just means that they are in need of love… it’s like a beacon.
wow wow wow…
Love reading these posts above ! and laughing at times...
chick tracts... Walter Martin ... Evangelsion Explosion ... now I recall my times in all of these and more ...
:laughing: :laughing: :laughing:
being really obnoxious at times I even pretended to be standing there so I could get involved in "Fencing"
with aggressive evangelistic guys and gals... :laughing:
I also used to do a lot of "street" witnessing too in downtown Seattle ...
along with evangelizing of all kinds of places .. including different countries too...
but I have very little sure understanding of the results --- lots of discussions ended in stalemate...
Some Christians I know that are very conservative do at times walk into meetings or lunch rooms
and yell --- pretending to be a current clone of Finney, Spurgeon, Moody, Sunday, et al....
Now I am living more than head deep and completely surrounded by those who do not believe
or agree with or accept a typical Westernized Church or even Orthodox ( EO, OO et al... )
in Korea there is one of the largest Churches in the World ( at least before --) and it also
has its own Spiritual dimension as well...
Taiwan even has enough different Religious groups all clambering for members....
including the True Jesus Church and the Local Church ( by Witness Lee )
On one side to say that sharing the Gospel does not belong to their personality
could be an excuse as it is for my super conserv. friend who has little relational skills
to present Jesus without attempting to cram the threat of Hell down their throats... :wink: :wink:
On the other side Paul's task and his missionary adventures were mostly goaded on by Jesus
as said in Acts ... after his Damascus Road experience ...
It seems to me that James had a different emphasis to follow too...
( No .. James & Paul do not have any conflict at all.. contrary to more than enough
who pit James 1 and Paul ... sorry Luther ... )
in my estimation Paul & James have identical perspectives ... :smiley:
So what do I do here ? Unless it comes up in a conversation or a situation
I have little anxious "guilt" feelings that I am not doing enough ...
actually rarely ... and when some shadowy feeling tries to sneak in ...
I just open the Window wider and allow the "Light" to shine everywhere ...
Col 3:12 has very good advice ... in my estimation for any relational interaction ...
Best of all I believe by having enough "Passion" .. meaning putting more than enough
effort towards being friendly, kind, polite, caring .. seeking MUTUAL benefit ..
being not embarrassed to give an "apologia" when needed ..
treating each person with dignity ... evaluating another's attitude and responding to it ..
I know Asians had a layer of politeness.. and under that layer .. there is a potential pit bull
:laughing: :laughing: so I try not to knock over the neatly piled up tomato cans in the supermarket
( analogy ) but I will not worry sometimes about meeting obnoxious people with
good ole american sarcastic wit ...
I find that using the body language of smiley behavior with loaded american english
releases my steaming annoyed reaction .. while greatly reducing the potential pit bull
from getting into the fray ... :laughing: :laughing:
I really enjoyed reading the Considerate attitude and feelings posted above...
Refreshing breeze on a summer eve..
all the best!Incidentally, did you eventually read the sequel to your younger girls, Sonia?
Yep! MacDonald’s books are always full of great stuff.
I’m currently reading them The Hobbit since the movie is coming out soon. I started it at the beginning of summer and it’s taking forever to read because we’ve been so busy. I’m glad we’re at the end of August and life can settle into some kind of routine again!
Sonia
From a novel I wrote aeons ago…
The following morning, Benjomin knocked on the Austrian’s door, hoe in hand. “I’ve come to weed your garden,” he said.
The big man beamed.
“My name is Benjomin Kohan,” he continued, offering his hand.
“Well met,” the Austrian replied, crushing his soft hand in a farmer’s grip. “My friends call me Ino.” Then eying Benjomin’s thin arms, he nodded. “I will help with that hoeing.” Striding towards his barn, he called over his shoulder. “Tell me, Benjomin. What do you know of the Kabbalah? And can I interest you in a game of chess?”
Benjomin soon discovered that his new-found friend, the champion scythe-wielder, was in fact an Austrian aristocrat. Ino von Lothringen had relinquished his title, sold his considerable assets and given most of the proceeds to the poor. With what remained, he had bought five thousand acres of Hungarian wilderness and invited others to come and form a community. It was a lunacy modeled on the Moravian Brethren of Count Zinzendorf some two centuries before, and unlike most of the sane policies followed in the early twentieth century, Ino’s madness actually seemed to work.
Benjomin learned that the short fat man who had given him the chickens was once an esteemed Professor of Philosophy at Wittenberg. When not attending to his hens, he was writing his great work—A New Epistemology—on the kitchen table. The woman who had provided the potatoes was an opera singer. She now conducted the chapel choir and had five beautiful children. She was married to a lapsed Augustinian monk—a tall, shy, bumbling, good-hearted fellow who looked like a simpleton, but could speak twelve languages and read twenty.
“This land is shared by all and owned by none,” Ino explained as they hoed his corn patch. “What is private property but a line drawn on a page, one man saying I am greater than you! In the same way, we have no rank. We are all God’s children. We have no priesthood. What child needs a priest to stand between him and his father? We will not bear arms or require brother to murder brother. If God will not save us from our enemies, neither will we. We will die content. As for day-to-day affairs, we elect elders every spring—men and women both, yes?—so long as they’re of good character. We give power little time to corrupt.”
“What is this belief? What do you call yourselves?”
Ino shook his head. “Too much blood has been shed over names.”
“But we need names, surely? And private property. What would you do if a thousand Turks marched over that hill and drove you from your homes?”
Ino shrugged. “They killed Jesus too. Should we expect more?”
“So you are Christian, at least?”
“I am like Christ?” he replied, laughing. “I wish to God I were! No. I am a hopeful agnostic. Can a tiny creature like me speak with certainty about God? In weakness and great doubt, I follow Christ as best I can. He awes me, you know. He forgives his enemies even as they nail him down! Think on that. This ancient Jew is the greatest of men. Any god who is less than this man nauseates me.”
Ino flexed his shoulders and scratched his beard. “No one here shares my views on all things, of course.” He winked. “Not all are as wise as I am, you understand. Each must believe the best he can believe.”
Benjomin smiled wryly. “A Christian agnostic,” he said, mopping sweat from his forehead. “I am a Jewish atheist. Why believe at all? There is too much pain in the world. God is evil or God is weak. Either way, God is not God.”
Ino bent down and pulled out a particularly stubborn thistle. “A theodicy,” he said, flourishing the weed, knocking the soil from its roots. “Imagine a Grand Master—yes? He places his queen just so. His child is watching and whispers, "Father, that is a very bad move! Your queen will be taken by the black knight!” “No, little one, the Master replies, that is a very good move. One day, if all goes well, you will grow big enough to see why.””
Benjomin chipped at some onion-weed. “God is nothing but our despair seeking comfort in delusion.”
Ino nodded. “You may well be right. I’ll not deny it. But I will wait until the Game is over before I curse God and die. Perhaps pain is necessary for some higher good. I hope with all my heart that this is so. I have wagered my life on it, but I simply don’t know. How could I know? Dear God, I can barely tie my shoelace! I am far too small to judge such weighty matters. But whether God exists or not, whether he is good or monstrous, I will do what I can do. I will try to love my brothers and sisters. These people, I can see.”
Benjomin looked back. “Ten long rows,” he said with some satisfaction.
Ino took a deep breath. “We have enjoyed the fresh air. Our blood is flowing. We have worked our muscles and our minds. And two men have moved a little closer towards friendship.”
Allan,
Thanks for sharing that! Is this a published book? Where can I find it?
Sonia