The Evangelical Universalist Forum

Pre-Marital Sex is it wrong

Practices Christian Living
#22

inkaboutit4ucom. replies*************************************************************************

But again you are taking it out of context and coming up with wrong conclusion.

The context in Corinth 1 Cor 10:8 and in Nu 25:1-9 Nu 31 is NOT single sex or premarital sex, it is about avoiding joining in with the pagan worship of a Baal’s pagan fertility god worship as a creator god.

This is the focus and context. You totally ignore the major focus and major context totally. You don’t care about real truth , only about “tradition of Men” false teaching that has wrongly been pass down for way too long.

Also you take it out of context with sexuality in the whole Bible. You don’t even take the time to read all my writing and my web page that explains in more details.

http://inkaboutit4u.com/?p=Sexual_Freedoms_From_Bible_Examples

Again Paul is answering a letter written to him from the Corinth Church that we do NOT have. You are making wrong conclusion from half a conversation without know the other half.

So when we research deeply you discover that The Roman Empire forbid the Hebrews and Christians to NOT have Polygamy in fear that they will reproduce or multiply too fast and over power the Romans.

So to go along with pagan Roman laws which was only marry one spouse (God’s way and Hebrew’s way was male sexual freedom to have many sex partners and many many women at the same time), so Paul suggest single men get married and have sex everyday. So this may reduce the temptation to joining with the pagan fertility god worship.

The problem in Corinth is most all prostitutes were pagan fertility god worshippers paid by the pagan fertility religious to go around and sexually seduce men and women to come join them to worship their pagan fertility god.

In the OT and other places they had Many normal NON pagan non fertility worshiping prostitutes they could pay to have sex with when they desired. As we clearly see all over the OT because they had God or Hebrews Gov’t ruling over the Jewish people. When Jesus was on earth all the gospels were under law in the Age of the Laws. Age of Grace did not start until after Jesus death.

http://inkaboutit4u.com/?p=Polygamy_God_is_very_pro-polygamy__misunderstand_Deut_1717

Knowing that you see they had lot of God encourage sexual freedom and lots of Godly polygamy but when the Pagan Romans or Pagan Egypt ruled over them, they were FORCED to NOT have sexual freedom and NOT have polygamy because these pagan countries feared that they would over populate and over power them.

Today the USA follow these pagan Roman rules trying to take away God given sexual freedom That God gave all people for all times at creation.

Christians should all have sexual freedom including women.

Christians should promote polygamy and sexual freedom for all Christians

Christians should promote nudity for all Christians as God designed and God desires.

They have more sexual freedom when God , Hebrews rule over Hebrews. They alway had NON-pagan, NON fertility god non-worshipper prostitutes to pay to have sex with, also they could have sex with other single girls and if their masters loaned them one of their many wive to meet their sexual needs. (Ex 21:4) (This clearly is NOT fornication and NOT adultery per God).

If they got anyone pregnant, they could just marry them, because God is very pro-polygamy. (2 Sam 12:8 SOS 6:8) they had unlimited sex partner per God ( but NOT pagan fertility god worshippers wives like Solomon had near the end of his life when Pagan nations would give him these pagan worshipper wives so Solomon would not totally destroy them.

#23

Only in modern society is this generally true. But even today there are many exceptions to this all over the world, where open relationships are just as normal as closed ones. Additionally, you see many biblical examples of multiple wives. This was not immoral. Even in the NT where Paul says for Deacons “Man of one wife” implied that many were polygamous. As far as suggesting that they were less spiritual as a result is a stretch, especially since the reason could easily be because a man with many wives has a responsibility to those wives, therefore less time to be away from home and tend to the duties of the church.

The way I see it, there is no reason to spiritualize these things when we can use some common sense (at least, what seems common sense to me) for the reasons Paul wrote what he did. If culture supports polygamy and no harm is done to individuals on that account, I see no reason to believe it is wrong.

#24

OK. I’m going to be “controversial” here. I don’t believe in EITHER homosexual or premarital sexual relationships But it’s alright to have premarital relations, between a human and a zombie. As long as they are of the opposite gender. Let me explain.

Let’s assume that evolution is true. And animals evolved into humans. It’s plausible…before Adam was given, the spark of life by God…there were beautiful men and women animals…for all practical purposes, that were real zombies. And they had all the characteristics, of attracting REAL humans - like Adam and Eve. They looked like humans, walked like humans and had sex like humans - but were REALLY zombies. And Adam probably had sex, with the female zombies…before and after the fall. And the same might be true for Eve.

So if our poster is going to argue, for premarital sex - between humans…Then it’s OK for me, to come out of the closet…and argue for premarital sex, between a human and a zombie. As long as they are of opposite genders.

And this ALL fits into, this forum topic: Premarital Sex is it wrong

And DON’T try to tell me, they DON’T exist. They are “alive and well” in Haitian voodoo.

#25

Randy, you are going to get this topic locked. I honestly can’t tell if you are joking or serious… If you are joking, OK… But some of your stuff almost seems like you believe it and that makes me want to put you into the crazy bucket where I listen to nothing you say, which could be a shame. I may miss out… But you have some sort of zombie fettish, and I don’t know why. Look, I love TWD series too, I even sometimes watch Z Nation, but it ends when I turn off the TV.

#26

Hi, Gabe. This won’t lock the topic…as long as I don’t show graphic sexual images, cartoons or videos…or use non-censored cuss words…After all, I am sticking to the topic at hand. And it’s up to folks here, to figure out - if I’m crazy or not. Or joking or not. And I gave my reasoning, why I think zombies exist - before and after the fall. Along with being in Haiti. I get the BIG question is this: If they exist, are they alive, dead, or somewhere in-between?

And I end with this - for now

Polonius says of Hamlet’s responses, “Though this be madness, yet there is method in’t.”

#27

Randy, where do you live? i’d like to meet you sometime. I travel a lot for work (well used too, and I might again soon). I think meeting you in person would help me understand you much, much better. :slight_smile:

#28

Like my profile says - Chicago area. I would be happy to meet anyone, from the forum. As long as we make arrangements in advance. And my responses are no more - nor less - “far out”, then some of the posters and viewpoints - on this forum. More later. As I might be signing off shortly.

#29

Cool. My wife’s sister lives just outside (as in 4 miles from downtown) Chicago. I also may plan a fun trip there with a buddy of mine later. I’ll let you know, maybe meet somewhere where the “L” Train can take us.

#30

Cool, Gabe. A female friend of mine, lives in Chicago. And for the record, she is not a zombie. So I might be visiting Chicago a bit. And would love to meet you and your family. And to understand me, you need to ;

  • understand the Eastern Orthodox / Eastern Catholic - Holy Foolery (1, 2) tradition…

  • the Native American Lakota Heyoka and Coyote traditions…

  • and how Shakespeare approaches, crafting his plays.

And if you make some time, I can take you to some of my spiritual traditions - in the area - as my guest. If you are up for it - that is. And I do crazy things, from time to time. Like there’s a person, who lives in Chicago - getting his PhD from Northwestern. But I was hanging out last summer,…with his brother and his wife from Peru - who are REAL shamans.

#31

inkaboutit4ucom*******************************************************************************

I would agree.

Having sex with a women does NOT mean you become married. In the Bible they had lot of prostitutes sex and they were not married either before of after.

Sexual outside of Marriage is sometimes OK. NOT adultery See Ex. 21:4

In Ex 21:4 a master loans one of his wives to meet his servant SEXUAL needs. This is NOT adultery NOR fornication of any kind. NOT any sin of any kind. 100% with God.

In Ex 21:4 The master’s wife was only a sexual loaner to meet the servant sexual needs. The wife was always owned by the master, because if the servant left he would have to return the masters wife back to the master and return all the children made by the master’s wife were the masters, because the masters wife produced them by having sex with the servant.

This was normal, the question came up, was, who would own the children produced by the servant and the master’s wife, if the servant left. The answer is the master who sexually loaned the wife to his male servant would owns the children also.

In the Bible days men had lots of sexual freedom to have sex with many women because they understood God gave sexual freedom to all At creation including all humans for all times. Acception in OT women who had male authority over them, the master could limit or give more sexual freedom as he desired. 2 Sam 12:8, SOS 6:8 both having unlimited sex partners from God. But to you also today and for all times.

God gave all creation sexual freedom at creation. David and Solomon and most in the OT understood this. We also have this in the NT or Age of Grace. Christian have more sexual freedom then they had in the OT. (NOT less)

Christian are NOT under the Age of the Law.

Christian are DEAD to the LAW. Only law is law of love with God given sexual freedom

Christians under the LAW of LOVE.

Christians have maximum sexual freedom to love many.

Christians also have unlimited sex partners as in 2 Sam 12:8 and SOS 6:8.

Christians can do wife swapping if desired. per Ex 21:4.

Christians can do polygamy and have more wives and concubine then Solomon had. SOS 6:8

Many example of God given sexual freedom all over the Bible.

God is very pro-nudity, very pro-sexual freedom, very pro-polygamy, very pro- swingers,

In this web site there are many examples of this sexual freedom in the Bible.

http://inkaboutit4u.com/?p=Polygamy_God_is_very_pro-polygamy__misunderstand_Deut_1717

http://inkaboutit4u.com/?p=Sexual_Freedoms_From_Bible_Examples

#33

Qaz, I think your interpretations of why Paul urged marriage, as well as Jesus’ concern about lust, are quite sensible (Inkaboutit’s appeared more strained to me). My impression is that the main Biblical concern here is morally condemning adultery and preserving fidelity to one’s marriage partner, while little concern is focused on premarital sex, which would not be such a direct threat to martial unions (or frankly, to a husband’s sense of ownership). Still, I think you are right in deducing that the implicit assumption is that sexual union is intended for a covenantal type of marriage commitment and that Paul sees the freedom in marriage for sexual union as one of the rich benefits it provides.

#34

Polygamy was allowed in Old Testament times, polygamy means to have to stay together with multiple wifes as well and provide for them. This is not what people nowadays usually practice, nobody has three girlfriends that know of each other and treats them equally and provides for them for lifetime. Well Mormons do, I don’t know if Mormons actually sin by doing so, but this is not what we are discussing. Does the US allow poligamy?

#35
  • Do the laws and rules of the Old Testament, still apply after the New Testament? If so, which ones? Why can’t I have the same prosperity, as Solomon, Abraham, etc.? After all, it’s part of the Old Testament.

And

I think I got the posters mixed up. My questions REALLY apply to this poster!

Look., I’m going to be as aggressive as you are…regarding my position on premarital sex, between a human and a zombie - of opposite genders…as you are between two unmarried human beings. But I’ll put on my Socrates hat and ask some questions:

  • And WHAT do you base this upon? Regarding Got Questions got the definition wrong? And WHO has gotten the definition right? And how do you KNOW it’s right? Do you know Greek and Hebrew? Do you know the position on premarital sex, of the person who created the dictionary entry?

  • Do you also agree with premarital sex, between two men or two women? Or even marriage between two members, of the same gender? Why or why not? For the record, my position is that marriage (and sex) is between - a man and a woman.

  • Do you agree with my position, that premarital sex is OK… between a human and a zombie? As long as they are of opposite genders?

  • Do the laws and rules of the Old Testament, still apply after the New Testament? If so, which ones? Why can’t I have the same prosperity, as Solomon, Abraham, etc.? After all, it’s part of the Old Testament.

And if you ignore my questions, I’ll keep bringing them up again! That’s a promise!

My own position is you are taking Bible verses, out of context. In court terms, “lay some foundation” to the verses first.

Hey, everyone. Isn’t this female zombie, in this video sexy? I’ll bet she has, a strong libido also. And doesn’t talk that much during sex.

What does everyone think…about the female zombie, in this video? Isn’t she really sexy?

#36

i don’t think I am aggressive.

Homosexuality is an abomination, at least between men.

Of course marriage is between a man and a woman (or multiple women).

Zombies, wtf?

Some rules apply still, others do not, or are you implying, murder or theft is no longer forbidden? Neither Jesus nor Paul forbid to steal, so you think it is ok to steal now? I tend to say the 10 commandments still apply maybe with exception of keeping the Sabbath. Sunday is not the Sabbath and the NT teaches that Christians need not care about days.

#37

No, you are not aggressive. I got the posters mixed up and revised my prior post. Sorry for any confusion. It’s early in the morning here.

But you really didn’t answer my question. Do the rules of Old Testament prosperity still apply? The health and property gospel preachers, would have us believe that.

#38

I’d say the 10 commandments maybe with the exception of observing the Sabbath.The NT explicitly condemns sexual immorality and even tightened the rules.

#40

How are you certain that this ancient rule about homosexuality still applies, or that non-heterosexuals are an “abomination” ? As a heterosexual, placing such condemning judgments on those who are not like me makes no sense and appears needlessly ungracious.

#42

Let me summarize, this thread’s central message…via a song, we can all sing along with! :smile:

“Health does not always come from medicine. Sometimes it comes from peace of mind, peace in the heart, peace in the soul. It comes from laughter and love.”-- Author Unknown

And this brings to mind, Eastern Orthodoxy, and the Native American Red Road…With unchanged truths and ways, passed down throughout the centuries.

#43

Just get married. Really. Then you can run around nekkid all you want, watch porn with your spouse, fornicate to yer heart’s content (if those are your thing) , and stop pushing others into immorality. Easy-peasy.
And you’ll learn how love is both easy and difficult, but all worth it.

We all know who the -‘sexually active’ really are, right? - it’s MARRIED people.

#44

Here’s Joseph Prince’s perspective:

Joseph Prince - Experience Victory Over Sexual Immorality (Full Sermon) 23-Aug-2015