Hi guys,
I was thinking about the term “son of perdition” which was used by Jesus in John 17:12 to refer, I think to Judas. I looked up the word perdition and it is defined as “loss of soul, eternal damnation”(Free online dictionary), which would speak either to conditional immortality or ECT. I was wondering what your take on this was because the impression I get from son of perdition is that Judas’ eternal destiny was fixed and it is a concept that seems to support the calvinistic reading?
Hi Sazag84,
I’m a Calvinist and I believe Judas is a clear understanding of the sovereignty of God and the will of man working together. I don’t know if Judas eternal destiny was “fixed” per say but yes he was born to perish and God knew that Judas would betray Christ. He was chosen not for eternal condemnation but to give God the glory so that His divine plan would come to fruition but Judas was without excuse because many times Judas heard the gospel and was taught by Jesus Christ Himself, spent 3 years with the Christ heard the teachings and seen and even performed miracles and Jesus even warned Judas of the path he was on but Judas refused to listen, refused to repent and change his ways. Judas may have carried out his evil act but God used it for our good and His glory.
Hi Sarah, The interesting thing is that the same word (used for the loss/destruction/perdition of Judas in John 17.12, is used of the sheep, the coin and the younger son in Luke 15. In those cases, and I believe in the case of Judas, being lost was not the end of the story - it was the prelude to being found!
Sazag84,
In John 17:12, the greek word that was translated “perdition” is “apōleia”. This is a derivative of the greek word “apollymi”.
When Jesus says that He came “seek and to save the lost” (Luke 19:10). The greek word for “lost” here is “apollymi”.
Our translations are biased towards the theology of ECT. I don’t think the translators intended for this to happen, however they were subject to their own (limited) understanding while they were translating.
I believe an unbiased rendering of the greek text would make it apparent that Judas is exactly who Jesus came to save.***
“For I take no pleasure in the death of anyone, declares the Sovereign LORD. Repent and live!” -Ezekiel 18:32
-AaronK
Yes, and most of us here would agree that destruction in the scriptures is usually followed by restoration.
I’m also reminded that before we are saved we were all “Sons of Disobedience” and “Children of Wrath” by nature…
Eph 2 –
And you were dead in your trespasses and sins, in which you formerly walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, of the spirit that is now working in the sons of disobedience. Among them we too all formerly lived in the lusts of our flesh, indulging the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, even as the rest. But God, being rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us …
Sonia
Thanks for the responses guys. This is interesting to me because it also reflects almost a present state of being lost. In traditional thought we are always viewed as being either on the road to heaven or perdition depending on our relationship on our standing before God but the use of apollymi for the prodical son suggests that he is already in handed over to eternal misery? This seems to support both Sherman and Rob Bell’s idea that actually we experience eternity here and now, whether heaven or hell. This also has an implication of thought that if hell is in the here and now and we can be delivered from it by grace through faith in Jesus, then there is at least hope that those who die without Christ maybe delivered from hell. Sorry I’ve hijacked my own thread. 
just learned two really interesting things tonight.