bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-23986595
Looks interesting … Where have I heard of this family before, I wonder …
Just read the write-up on the BBC website. Dingaling alert:
"The girls believe that the UK in particular is a hotbed for “witchcraft” because of the popularity of J K Rowling’s Harry Potter books.
“The spells and things that you’re reading in the Harry Potter books, those aren’t just something that are made up, those are actual spells. Those are things that came from witchcraft books,” says Tess."
Yeah right.
This was the dude who said on Hellbound he listened to the demons as well as God (to get his doctrine of hell). 
Also, the video clip is quite nutty - making exorcism as stage show and asking for donations of a few hundred dollars
And home education …
And the fat that he only screens for mental illness with one-to-ones, not the stage shows …
I think this is gonna make xtians look very wacky … I hope the BBC followed up the possesed before and after to see what effects (if any) there were.
if they think JK Rawling is witchcraft, they are guilty of ignoring REAL witchcraft, which has little to do with the “occult” (which is a virtually meaningless buzzword that could easily be applied to many Christine doctrines) and more to do with providing false alternatives to God…and that could be Tarot, or it could be shopping channels, or it could be happy clappy churches that create intellectual idols of God, or rigid and sober churches that treat God is a far away tyrant to whom we are scum…and it could be health/wealth “gospel”.
it could even be this “doctrine” of ECT
I have experienced both being delivered from demonic spirits and casting out demonic spirits from a person. Both resulted in lasting positive change, freedom. Personally, I was praying one day by myself and felt a burden lift off my shoulders. It suprised me and I asked God “What was that?” To which He responded, “I just delivered you of a spirit of false humility.” I didn’t even know that I was oppressed by such, but after that I noticed a marked difference in my response to others concerning myself. I stopped making light of my strengths and talents, was more honest about who I really was. False humility tries to minimize one’s talents, authority, position, etc. True humility rejoices in one’s giftings, acknowledges God as our sourse, and recognizes one’s limits. True humility is very liberating.
Concerning seeing others delivered, the most radical example I’ve personally participated in was a woman who had been bound by paralyzing fear for many years. In short, she came to a place where she was too afraid to leave her house. For two years she had not stepped outside her front door. One day she was praying and watching tv and the Lord spoke to her that He’d deliver her if she went to a specific healing conference. She went and experienced nothing but fear for two days. Conference ended and she was still overwhelmed by fear. Decided to stay one more day thouh. My wife and I did not go to the conference but happened to be eating lunch that Sunday at the hotel restaurant. Afterward lunch we walked around the pond on the hotel grounds. We ran into this couple and didn’t know them or that there was a problem. We started talking and the next thing I know she falls on the ground, hissing and writhing like a snake. We started praying for her for several hours. It was a wild day. Ended up baptizing her later that evening in the hotel’s pool. Said our good-byes and a year later got a letter from her thanking us for praying for her. She had subsequently been traveling the world and was very thankful for us taking time to help her.
Concerning these girls and their dad, I’d have to take significantly more time to review their material before I had an informed opinion. And I wouldn’t make an opinion based on a couple of reports done on BBC, assuming that such would reporting would be biased negatively against the girls. I also recognize that just because someone has mixed motives for what they do, does not disqualify them from being used by God. I’ve also come to recognize that just because in my opinion someone is acting strange or doing something differently than I’d do it, that doesn’t mean they are wacky. I mean, Jesus made a ball of mud and spit and put it in a guys eye and told him to go wash in some pool - kinda stange. And of course the Gospels speak of Jesus and the disciples casting out demons when people manifested them.
It would be interesting to interview these people months after the event and see it they’ve seen any positive changes in their lives. Of course, Jesus also warned of casting out a spirit and if the house is not filled with good but left empty that the spirit would come back 7 times worse. Personally, I think the best way to cast out evil spirits is to be filled with the Holy Spirit which comes through prayer, baptism, making things right and doing good, studying scripture, worship, etc. The light need not fear the darkness.
I hear what you’re saying Sherman. I have no problem with the reality of demons or possession. But some things here just don’t smell right (like asking for donations to perform exorcisms, thinking Harry Potter is ‘real’, turning it into a performance show, believing the ‘demons’ words about hell, and poor screening for mental illness).
But you’re right about delaying judgement until more is known. 
Yep, at least the way it’s presented is certainly fishy. Of course, many ministers have a fee they charge to come speak at a church or conference. And many pastors get paid for their service to the church, so to me it’s the same. And scripture certainly endorses the concept of supporting ministers and ministries. To me, the silver cross thing turns my stomach; it seems real religious but I don’t see it as a necessary thing. Then again I don’t have a regular ministry of casting out demons.
More info for the curious:
boblarson.org/
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bob_Larson
Of particular interest:
"In 2013 Vice magazine taped a video if Larson’s visit in several small towns in Ukrane where he performed exorcisms together with three teenage girls - his 18-years-old daughter Brynne Larson and her friends Tess and Savannah Sherkenback (18 and 21 respectively, all known as The Teenage Exorcists).[5] The Teenage Exorcists consequently published a reply to Vice Media’s video stating that they “question the journalistic integrity of this Vice Media story and are disappointed by how we were falsely portrayed.” (wiki)
You can even take his ‘Have you got a demon?’ test here:
demontest.com/
Costs 9.95 to take the demon test. 
I’ve heard enough stories from reliable people to believe that demon possession is real, but these people seem like they’re in the business to make money.
Sonia
Of course it does, silly me. And another few hundred to actually get rid of the demon after the test comes back positive I guess … He seems to offer a Skype service too …
Oh, and if you like the crosses he uses you can have one for $100. Each one specially anointed by Bob.
From his blog site:
“Beth’s demon, Necromancy, challenged Bob and the Teenage Exorcists. It didn’t want to leave, but had no other choice, but to pronounce it’s doom (go to the pit). After the deliverance, Tess anointed her. Beth hugs the Teenage Exorcists, with a smile of relief from the demon that tormented her for years.
P. S. You must get my DVD of the violent exorcism of Viktor that took place in Siberia, Russia. You’ll see this exorcism in real time, exactly as it happened without editing, something I’ve never done before. For your gift of $50 or more to help erase the financial deficit of our LIBERATE LONDON Mission I’ll send this DVD, THE EXORCISM OF VIKTOR, a display of God’s power you’ll show to everyone.”
Looks like London wasnt very liberated … ( and he needs someone to proof read his writing).
Sorry Sherman but the more I explored his website the less I trusted him. I could post a lot of thing that I personally am suspicious about, but it wouldn’t be good to do that, and I think I’ll try and suspend judgement a little longer. I hope that by the grace of God he is doing more good than harm, but I have my reservations. .
Mat 10:8 Heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse those who have leprosy, drive out demons. Freely you have received; freely give.
That pretty much says it …
Sonia
Yep, wake up and smell the coffee guys, Bob Larson is full of shit. He’s a rip-off merchant of the first water, him and his wannabe Charlie’s Angels ‘Exorcist’ daughter and her buddies. Here it is, verbatim from the man’s website:
What a wanker.
More money-grubbing exorcism-begging from the odious Larson:
And here is an utterly damning eyewitness account of some of Larson’s despicable, cynical and dangerous fakery:
I’m not making this stuff up, honestly:
To no one in particular, though it was Bryan and Baxter’s report that started me thinking this way,
I would say to them, I’m curious, when you cast out demons, how do you go about it? Or when you heal the sick, do you lay hands on people or just speak the Word? And when you prophesy, does the word come to you all at once or just a word at a time, or do you speak extemporaneously? And have you seen miracles through your ministry? And has God ever inspired you to tell a widow to take her last piece of bread and cheese and make you grilled cheese sandwich first, trusting that God would work a miracle to feed her and her son?
I suppose my point is, it’s far too easy for those who are not doing to critisize those who are. I do not mean to express support of Bob Larson’s ministry; I do intend though to indicate that I believe that some people are oppressed by spiritual evil and that they need deliverance. Jesus did come to set the captives free, to deliver people from this present evil age. And as I’ve shared before, I am reticent to critisize another minister, disagree with specific teachings and practices, but reluctant to negatively judge them. And it always amazes me how God can heal, deliver, and save people through such messed up vessels as me who has come to realize that everything I do is polluted by my selfishness.
I believe it is much better to turn a light on than to curse the darkness. There are people who believe that misuse their spiritual gift; but I don’t know if that’s worse than not using one’s spiritual gifts at all. I think God sees things far differently than we do.
I think Bob would have much more credibility if:
-
he was humble rather than describing himself as the worlds foremost expert on cults and the occult
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he didn’t ask for large sums of money every two seconds
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he used doctors and psychiatrists to help support his work, especially when it came to confirming possessees mental health status, personal background and genuineness
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that he didn’t perform exorcisms as a show
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that he didn’t pepper his site with dramatic testimonies (I placed the cross on my husband, he was instantly healed) without any attribution, evidence or details
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he didn’t employ techniques of crowd control that looked like the techniques used by cult leaders and other manipulators of mass hysteria etc that are well known to journalists and paranormal investigators
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he had some sort of recognised qualifications in theology to support his doctrinal pronouncements rather the just believing what the demons tell him
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he had some sort of medical and counselling training
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he screened people for mental health difficulties first
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he didn’t try to do this stuff via Skype or over the radio
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his ministry wasn’t part family business (nepotism), part circus show
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that exorcism wasn’t the sum total of his ministry
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he didn’t sell crosses for $100
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he had some sort of accountability
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his website didn’t have poor writing, grammar, punctuation etc
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he promoted Jesus more than himself
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he didn’t routinely edit his video footage
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he hadn’t been involved in the 80s satanic scare against rock music and role-playing games, and then later changed his mind on modern xtian rock music
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he wasn’t the subject of two independent critical TV documentaries and investigations
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he didn’t think that Harry Potter contains real magic spells
Now, it may be that he’s sincere. It may be that his exorcisms are always, or sometimes, real. I cannot know for sure sitting here on my computer. But even if these things are true, then I would argue that by adopting very bad practices (see above) he is helping the name of Jesus be subject to ridicule, mockery and dismissal, and is opening himself to all manner of accusations. He might also be causing a lot of psychological harm to many people - is anyone checking? So I’d argue that even if he’s sincere and effective (which I am suspicious of and he still needs to prove to me) then he may still be doing more harm than good until he radically changes his ministry model.
The Anglican and Catholic Churches have specialist exorcists; Pentecostals have been casting out demons for generations, and having been part of Pentecostal and Charismatic churches I’ve witnessed a few. Evangelicals sometimes get involved also, even non-conservatives like Greg Boyd. But I don’t ever remember any of those dudes making the whole thing into a stage show or asking for loads of dosh. And even the faith-healers who cast out demons as part of their repertoire at least throw in healing and teaching as a bonus
I think it is easy for those of us who accept the reality of demons, possession, deliverance, supernatural healing etc to overlook what everyone else sees in cases like this because we really want our worldview supported and our beliefs confirmed. We offer wide scope and great largesse to anyone who seems to be doing the supernatural stuff we think the church should be doing and often look over the danger signs. But we should demand of those close to our own supernaturalistic worldview a greater accountability, for we should be aware of just how damaging getting this stuff wrong is. I dread to think of how non-Christians watching this on TV are going to react, what they’re going to think, and what stick Christians are going to get in Britain the day after all because Bob wasn’t adopting careful, wise and accountable practices.
How do I cast out demons, heal the sick etc. ? Well, I have very, very limited experience (though not zero), but I can tell you some things I would do if I was responsible for a church and involved in this stuff. Here’s a simple one for a start: all reported deliverances and healings that were to be declared publicly must be accompanied by strong medical support and before/after evidence of change. If you say you got healed of x, I want to see clear medically supported evidence of x before the healing, a clear description of the healing process, and then medical support backing up the unexpected healing of x afterwards. I also wanna see further evidence of permanent change six months later. Another easy one: when casting out demons get to know the situation first, and when possible screen for mental illness. Afterwards, follow the same evidence gathering procedure as for healings backed by medical professionals. And one more: make sure that everything is done decently and in order, with multiple trained and qualified personnel with mutual accountability, make sure everything is recorded and verified and subject to regular review. Oh, and don’t ask for cash. Just heal the suffering.
^^An excellent critique, pog. Except you are far too respectful to the poisonous ‘McExorcist’ (respect to whoever thought up that nickname for him 
).
Spot on. Spot on. One of the most damaging aspects of McExorcist’s flim-flam is the corrosive effect it has on genuine evangelism. The only people who fall for the act are those who desperately want to. Anyone else, including those who may be looking into the faith for the first time, will only conclude that Christians are all nutters. (Of course, some of us are .)
McExorcist is a scumbag; a cruel, vain, arrogant, cynical, greedy, duplicitous charlatan. Blimey, he makes Benny Hinn look like Martin Luther King. (Did I mention greedy?) He has not the tiniest shred of credibility or integrity, and he should be treated accordingly. I don’t buy the argument that God can use even bad people, with bad motives, for good. You might as well say it doesn’t matter what we do, or what our motives are, because God will get what he wants anyway. He will, of course, but it makes a big difference whether we’re with him or against him.
As you know, pog, I am strongly agnostic about the existence of demons anyway, so it’s very easy for me to see McExorcist for what he is - a con man. I just feel sorry for those he has conned, many of them doubtless in real need of healing, and also for those sincere believers whose faith is being held up for ridicule.
Hey Pog,
I must say, that’s one of the most well thought out and graciously stated criticisms that I’ve read. Excellent, spot-on as Johnny said. Thanks
Blessings,
Sherman
Thanks for the kind words Sherman/Johnny.
Anyone else expecting some difficult questions and general all-round Christ-bashing at their work this week? sigh