The Evangelical Universalist Forum

Universalist Prophets?

Evangelical Universalism
#1

I’ve seen a lot of convincing prophets on youtube who talk about dreams and visions they receive and as far as I can tell they are all traditional hell believers. Do any of you know of universalists on the internet who claim to have dreams and visions? How much weight do you place on such things? The only test I know of in the bible to see if the person is of God or not is if they confess that christ came in the flesh but like… every christian prophet does and they have conflicting visions and dreams so yeah…

I’ve had a few of these experiences myself, and in mine we don’t even get literally raptured, we get raptured in SPIRIT and then fight a great war with all the same connections to God and power He had. It’s hard to know what to believe when not even personal experience seems to always be able to be trusted. Thoughts?

#2

Well, visions can have both a medical and scientific explanation. And they can have a demonic cause also. But they also can be real. BUT THEY ARE SUBJECT TO INTERPRETATION. And that’s the sticking point.

Now I talk extensively, on another thread here. About the Zombie Apocalypse, being the most probable - end times, tribulation model. And someone accused me, of not being Biblical. Well, nothing they are saying - conflicts with the book of Revelations. And they are just adding another element, that might unfold. And we DON"T KNOW, if what they are seeing is literal or metaphorical. And having some deeper meaning.

As far as RC and EO saints go, I think Julian of Norwich comes close - to a universalist vision. Tiffany Snow is an Old Catholic, contemporary church mystic. I know her husband Billy Clark, who is an Old Catholic church priest. She sees every human, having postmortem opportunities for salvation. And the angels, who have not started participation - in the end times tribulation. And those humans who refuse, it appears to be some type of annihilation. You can see this vision described, by clicking on my profile. And viewing the link entitled END.

In reality, any Christian vision can’t conflict - with either Holy Scripture or Sacred Tradition. But this is hard to say, regarding some visions.

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#3

Thought provoking response. I thought your username was a joke but it’s cool to know you take it somewhat seriously. Unrelated to my topic (and I don’t care, I’m all about getting off topic that’s how real conversations go) I saw a video once made by a christian outlining how a zombie apocalypse was biblical and it blew my freakin mind. So I definitely… grasp how you’d come to such a conclusion.

I actually found some universalist prophets after some deep searching, but not that many. It’s like the eternal hell believers have this whole… culture built around their prophecies, and the universalists get one in a blue moon. That doesn’t necessarily mean anything, and it’s not necessarily a moot point, it’s like you said… we basically have no way of knowing other than just… strong hunches and our own personal experiences. But if one of us has a personal experience that proves it to that specific individual? For everyone else they just get added to the list of evidence. Nothing would “prove” anything unless we could all examine it at once…

#4

The Link on Tiffany Snow’s vision is End. I was given a hard time here, when I initially tried to follow, the Holy Fool tradition. But it’s a valid historical Christian path. Started in the Russian Orthodox Church. And honored by both Eastern Orthodox and Eastern Catholics alike.

I mentioned this book today - on another thread here. And it’s called Kindling The Native Spirit by Denise Lynn. Well, this book is available on Amazon. And on page 180, she describes a futuristic vision. Where there was fire and heat everywhere. And something terrible happened. Bu she also says this:

I was also aware, in my dream, that what I saw was a strong possibility, for our collective but, but it wasn’t carved in stone>"

Yes, this might occur. The Zombie Apocalypse might occur. But these events - even if literal, are NOT cast in stone. Much depends collectively on us.

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#5

My friend, absolutely nothing is cast in stone. Even if Jesus appears to us all tomorrow, explains the universe, and heals thousands, it could be a hologram, a technology we are unaware of, the levels of deception have reached unfathomable lengths. This is why day after day I’m beginning to believe that searching for proof of truth from someone else is pointless, and what makes sense is just following what makes sense to YOUR heart while being open and unbiasedly hearing everything others say out. It’s really just about not being rigid I think, being honest, admitting that the more you know the less you know.

However it’s reeeeally late for me (maybe early for you) I think I’m gonna put it down for now. Thanks for replying to my thread. I have another one that no one responded to that got buried, if this is cause I somehow offended everyone so be it, if it’s cause it just got lost in the shuffle, I’d like to revive it. It was called “I think the punishment is REAL” I thought it was also thought provoking, didn’t get any responses. Anywho, love you man, PEACE! :sunglasses:

#6

In lieu of me working on my response to your other thread, in the meantime, I must ask who are these universalist (YouTube) prophets? Lol. I’m sure, as you indicated that they’re a dime-a-dozen. Were they Unitarian universalists (ecumenical, SJW “Christians”) or Scriptural Christian universalists? Thanks for your dialogic inquiry symph.

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#7

I’m not sure if you’re understanding my original post. I’m talking about how I DON’T see youtube or online prophets, nor have I ever encountered any in the charasmatic movement, that DIDN’T have a strong belief in hell. It seems like all the Kim Clements and people who are posting their dreams and visions are warning about hell. Many of them seem far too sincere to just be fabricating lies, they seem at the very least to be legitimately deceived. I started searching for prophets (actually they call themselves “watchers” usually, not prophets come to think of it) who had had visions of reconciliation or didn’t believe in an everlasting hell but I couldn’t find even one, so I was wondering if you guys knew of any.

However, hehehehe… I’ve been praying so hardcore about this and asking God to just lead me to what’s true and I just so happened to meet a guy in my apartment complex while I was meditating outside who IS a prophetic universalist! I met with him yesterday and he prophecied over me and it was DEAD ON. I could truly feel the Holy Spirit as he prayed over me, everything he said matched my real experience, and while he didn’t know anything too specific about me like… concrete details I didn’t tell him, he kept seeming to read my mind and speak to the things I was thinking and feeling as I felt them. He told me about a biblical universalist church that means about an hour from where I live and I’m gonna start attending with him. I let him read the prophecy my dad gave me and he was just like “I’m sure your dad is sincere and said this thinking it was truly from God but that’s just nonsense, this came to deceive you”

It really REALLY felt like God showing me the truth to me and I felt so much lighter and more confident afterward. He told me that it was time for me to trust the Holy Spirit over all and that the gift of feeling God’s Spirit is not a given in life and if I continue to ignore Him in favor of family and other people I may lose my ability to hear Him at all and find every other voice drowning Him out more or less. Told me that the reason I drink is because a part of me is enraged at not being able to be who I really am and always having to be so dually conflicted and pulled in different directions inside. I’d never even thought of that I just thought I had insomnia but it made so much sense.

But yeah when I wrote this I was just going “All the youtube and charismatic prophets I know of talk a LOT about hell and seem to really believe it, where are the universalist prophets at? Is this evidence we’re wrong??” But I’m starting to think you can be prophetic and still get things wrong or speak from your own understanding. Would still love to find some universalist prophets though :slight_smile:

#8

Oh and if you’re curious who some of the hellfire prophets/watchers I’m talking about are, there’s Zab Pashke, Dana Ashlie, Lisa Haven, eagle eye opener, and all the people you stumble upon when going down those rabbit trails. I’m also referring to when I would go to charismatic churches with lots of “prophetic” people who also seemed sincere (though sometimes gave me the creeps) and could even tell you things about yourself they couldn’t know otherwise. Seems like I’ve never met a “prophet” who DIDN’T believe in hell, and deeply so! Well at least, until now… hehe

#9

Well me matey, what I was referring to was when you said:

#10

I will reply to the rest of your post(s) later when I have time my brother.

#11

OH! Pfffft… I forgot my own friggin post lol My bad, I think it’s because that made me think of youtube prophets and that’s not what I found. I went to tentmaker.org and found a list that had a few prophecies from universalists in history.

Oh wow, I just relooked at it, it’s just ONE prophecy and a book that may lean universalist. Here’s the link to check out yourself. https://www.tentmaker.org/Dew/Dew1/D1-1679Prophecy.html

You know it’s kind of funny, on the one hand the lack of visions and dreams showing universalism is alarming, but then again, look at how few visions were even given in the new testament, look at how Paul didn’t feel he could talk too much about his visit to heaven. Perhaps it’s actually evidence that we aren’t getting false words or being misled. I suppose that’s a possibility!

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#12

That comes to mind but its been a while since I watched it and don’t remember if he had a vision or not.

As for visions by people in this day in age i often times just ignore them. Everything that needed to be said in scripture was finished by Paul.

Many visions in this day in age often conflict one another and even themselves sometimes. I always wanted to ask these people, if hell is forever and you went there, how did you get out?

#13

God always works with small and few people in this and previous eons. Israel the smallest nation, 12 israelite deciples, few saved in Noah’s flood, narrow is the gate to the earthly israelite kingdom, 7000 in the apostasy of Israel to bahl, etc etc etc.

This is my general rule of thumb, but not always true as there are exceptions, if many people believe something to be true approach it with skepticism. Many teach eternal torment or annihilation. Not many teach universal reconciliation. Id take that as comfort instead of worry given scriptural precedent.

Also it should be noted that being zealots about something can make it manifest as a dream or vision.

Or in other words if you believe in something so much your brain can create visions or dreams created by the very belief itself. Especially during a n.d.e. when the body is dead but the brain is not.

That’s also why I wouldn’t put my weight on someone who even prophesies about universal reconciliation. For me scripture and logic and my own personal experiences is what confirms it for me.