There are diverse ways of being a Christian Universalist and what that means is we should be wary of folk who go, “Ah, well, the problem with universalism is it leads down this route, to this view…” Well, it might do but it might not! We need to be a little bit more discerning with those kinds of arguments.
Ironically, this is basically what most Calvinists believe for themselves, that is, everything will pan out for them in the end. Which mean those same arguments they use against UR can be turned right back to them. For clarity, the assertion that everybody makes it in the end will cause wordly living. Does their knowing that they are saved cause them to live worldly lives?
Exactly… it is fully inconsistent.
Funny thing is though, speaking of being inconsistent… some universalists themselves will turn right around and make the same inconsistent “worldly” charge against certain fulfilled eschatological positions they detest; making false assertions claiming that such positions excludes one from all responsibility for living a righteous life etc — again, blindly without basis.
It makes one wonder what they mean by ‘saved’, doesn’t it? I for one find it impossible to separate ‘faith’ and ‘works’; stating one ‘believes’ without any evidence in one’s life = 0.
I am not, of course, talking about ‘perfection’ in any sense.
Well it would be the standard evangelical meaning, simply being… getting into heaven after death. That is pretty much reflected in attitudes that bleat… “oh, so it doesn’t matter how unrighteously some live everybody goes to heaven” — of which you are no doubt aware even some universalists themselves likewise bleat; go figure?
Yep pretty much… one’s works ALWAYS reflects one’s beliefs, i.e., what we do pretty much shows who we are at our core.
I doubt that “knowing”, in the context I believe you are suggesting, would have that result. Had you said “thinking”, that would be another matter altogether.
Don’t some Calvinists think that unless a person knows he’s elect, he isn’t saved? Do these Calvinists admit then to believing that a person’s knowledge of being elect makes a person saved?