The Evangelical Universalist Forum

Young's Translation of Matthew 24:34

Theology Eschatology
#1

There’s been much debate over the meaning of “generation” in Matt. 24:34, but Young’s Literal Translation renders the verse as follows:

Verily I say to you, this generation may not pass away till all these may come to pass.

If that is a literal translation, is it possible that Jesus was simply saying that (from what was then revealed in scripture, and what He himself saw as a man), that generation might very well have lived to see His second coming?

He latter said (in the same chapter, verse 36), “of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels of heaven, but my Father only,” so it would seem to fit the context.

Any thoughts?

#2

I guessed why YLT used the “may” in their translation before I actually looked it up in Greek. It seems that YLT tried to express the subjunctive mode by the use of the “may”. That isn’t always a good idea to get a true translation.

In my opinion Royce Gruenler gave a much better explanation as to why Christ’s words were true in spite of appearances to the contrary. Those verbs are 2nd aorist tense, active voice, and subjunctive mode. Gruenler wrote that the aorist tense is indefinite and states only the fact of an action without specifying its duration. He says that when the aorist describes an action as a unit event, it may accentuate one of three possiblitites. Then he asks us to imagine a ball that has been thrown:

  1. Let fly (inceptive or ingressive)
  2. Flew (constative or durative)
  3. Hit (culminative or telic)

He suggests that if we view the verb as an ingressive aorist, Christ’s saying may be rendered, “I tell you the truth, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things begin to come to pass.”

Gruenler states that this nuance of the same aorist form may also be seen in the angel Gabriel’s words to Zechariah (Luke 1:20) "And now you will be silent and not able to speak untili the day γενηται ταυτα. (the same Greek expression for “come to pass”). Gruenler points out that not only the birth, but the adult ministry of John the Baptist is prophesied by Gabriel, yet Zechariah recovers his speech as soon as he writes the name of his infant son John on a tablet. Accordingly, v. 20 should be translated, “And now you will be silent and not able to speak until the day all these things begin to happen.”

#3

Thank you Don.

That could even help answer questions I’ve had about 1 John.

He knew there were false Christ’s and false prophets in the world, and that some of the things he’d been told to watch for were beginning to happen (and he wasn’t only writting to us, he was writting to a particular church at that time,)

Thank you Don.

#4

You have to remember that the entire 24th chapter of Matthew is a type of narrative and one should pay special attention to the word day and days used in the narration. In 2Pe 3:1-8 you have a guideline established for how long a prophetic day is.

2Pe 3:8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

I agree with Paidion’s answer in the forum but felt I should offer insight regarding prophetic days. The Joel prophecy starting at Ac 2:16 can certainly viewed from this perspective. I also believe the prophecy of Jesus starting at Mt 12:38 to 12:45 should be viewed in the same matter. There has been much contention over the centuries regard Jesus being in the tomb for 3 full days and nights, when in fact the sign Jesus was giving, was that by the Spirit he would be in the heart/hearts of the earth reconciling all men to God for 3 thousand years. That wicked generation he gave the sign to, would not come up in resurrection until the white throne judgment, verse 42. Since that is at the end of the 7th day, it would in fact be at the end of the 3rd prophetic day of Jesus being in the heart of the earth. You also have the type of Gentiles/Nineveh in regards to Jonas. Jonas was called to go Nineveh and tell them to repent. Salvation is to the Jew first and then the gentile. Those of us in the body of Christ are members or citizens of the commonwealth of Israel, Eph 2:12. It is very detailed and difficult to wrap you mind around the enormity of it all.

#5

Much of Matthew 24 -Jesus’ narration- was coming to pass, or did come to pass whilst some of that generation were still alive. There has to be relevance to the audience addressed at the time (not necessarily exclusively so).
There is some difficulty with the latter part of Matt 24, but if Paidions explanation of a better translation “…until all these things begin to come to pass.”, is correct then it is more easily explained.
Jesus wasn’t, I think, speaking in riddles.

Ibwagner said:

2Pe 3:8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.

As this states BOTH a day being like a thousand years AND a thousand years being like a day (in God’s sight); this is hardly then a reason to assume that a prophetic day is equal to a thousand years? One might equally assume the reverse from this verse; a thousand prophetic days equals only one day in reality!
In the context of what Peter is saying, I believe he is simply stating God is not constrained by Time - His own creation. His coming is not delayed because He works to His own agenda and His own timetable.

S

#6

That’s great Paidion. I found a PDF file on **Grammatical Notations - Definition of the Grammatical Categories **that might help with these grammatical notations if anyone was interested:

calvarychandler.org/classes/Grammatical_Notations_study_guide.pdf

Note too that the word pass is in the Emphatic Future Negative, which basically means “This generation will definitely not pass away.”

Peace
S.

#7

That’s a good link Stefcui cheers.
S

#8

I’ve always had some difficulty understanding Matt. 5:18 (perhaps because I was taught that the Sabbath prefigures the Millennium.)

Is the word translated “fulfilled” (“come to pass,” or “occuring”) in verse 18 (different, btw, from the word translated “fulfilled” in verse 17) an ingressive aorist?

Could the meaning be that no jot or title would pass from the Law of Moses untill all began to be fulfilled at the birth of the Church, or at the fall of Jerusalem in 70 A.D., or something like that?

#9

They are two different words. The one in verse 17 is “πληροω”(plāro’ō), a word that means, “make full, fill to the top” or “made complete in every respect”.

The word in verse 18 is “γινομαι” (gin’omai) which mean “to become” or “to come to pass”.

#10

Hi Folks,

Mt 24:34 "Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place.

QUESTION: Which generation was Christ referring to in Matthew 24:34?

It is important to note that in this TIME TEXT verse, Jesus did not say "THAT generation …or THIS and THAT generation…but THIS generation only.

The Greek word “genea” (pronounced ghen-eh-ah’) appears thirteen times in Matthew’s gospel. Four times it is used to delineate “one set of parents to the next”. Ignoring Matthew 24:34 for the moment, in every other appearance, including 6 of the instances Matthew places the definite article “this” (houtos) before “generation”, “this generation” (houtos genea), in context, clearly cover the same group of people -i.e. “Christ’s contemporaries”

Mt 11:16 But to what shall I compare this generation? It is like children sitting in the market places, who call out to the other children, (the persons then living contemporary with Christ)

Mt 12:41 The men of Nineveh will stand up with this generation at the judgment, and will condemn it because they repented at the preaching of Jonah; and behold, something greater than Jonah is here. (the persons then living contemporary with Christ)

Mt 12:42 "The Queen of the South will rise up with this generation at the judgment and will condemn it, because she came from the ends of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and behold, something greater than Solomon is here. (the persons then living contemporary with Christ).

Mt 12:45 “Then it goes and takes along with it seven other spirits more wicked than itself… That is the way it will also be with this evil generation .” (the persons then living contemporary with Christ)

Mt 17:17 And Jesus answered and said, “You unbelieving and perverted generation, how long shall I be with you? How long shall I put up with you? …” (the persons then living contemporary with Christ)

Mt 23:36 "Truly I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation.

Reading Mt.23:36 in context again shows " the persons then living contemporary with Christ are being referred to:

  1. Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye build the sepulchres of the prophets, and garnish the tombs of the righteous, 30 and say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we should not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets. 31 Wherefore ye witness to yourselves, that ye are sons of them that slew the prophets. 32 Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers. :33 Ye serpents, ye offspring of vipers, how shall ye escape the judgment of Gehenna? 34 Therefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: some of them shall ye kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute from city to city: 35 that upon you may come all the righteous blood shed on the earth, from the blood of Abel the righteous unto the blood of Zachariah son of Barachiah, whom ye slew between the sanctuary and the altar. 36 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation. (the persons then living contemporary with Christ)

Mt 24:34
"Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place.

Vander

#11

I guess YLT translated that way because of the Greek word AN allegedly meaning:

“supposition, wish, possibility or uncertainty…an untranslatable word (under the circumstances, in that case, anyhow), the general effect of which is to make a statement contingent, which would otherwise be definite: it is thus regularly used with the subjunctive mood.”

“…a particle indicating that something can or could occur on certain conditions, or by the combination of certain fortuitous causes.”

biblehub.com/greek/302.htm

Some other versions are similar to YLT. For example:

34 Verily, I am saying to you that by no means may this generation be passing by till all these things SHOULD be occurring. (CLV)
34 Indeed I say to you, not not may pass away the generation this, till all these MAY be done.(Emphatic Diaglott)

Likewise this Greek-English Interlinear has “should”:

studybible.info/ABP_Strongs/Matthew%2024

#12

"It is indeed important to believe what the Scriptures say. Yet the deeper question still remains: In what sense is what the Scriptures say to be understood. As we approach this question of the time of Christ’s appearing, whether it is past or future, it should first of all be noted that in the Original, each of these statements of Jesus concerning His appearing (e.g., Matt.10:23b; 16:28; 24:34) is expressed in the subjunctive mood, sometimes with the conditional particle an (EVER) included. These grammatical features are reflected in the Concordant Version by the auxiliaries “should” and “may.”

"The subjunctive mood calls attention to the contingent (i.e., dependent) nature of what is being affirmed. It speaks of the connection which obtains between what is affirmed and that upon which the affirmation depends for its fulfillment. In the nature of things, if that upon which a declaration expressed in the subjunctive mood depends, is unrevisably certain, the declaration itself is unrevisable and is certain to occur. But if that upon which a declaration expressed in the subjunctive mood depends, is not unrevisably certain, the declaration itself is revisable and is not certain to occur.

"Of course that upon which the first-century fulfillment of these texts in question immediately depended, was the will of God, then revealed. If the will of God, then revealed, was peremptory (final, barring any possible recension for whatever reason), then these prophecies were certain to occur in that generation. But if the will of God, then revealed, was not peremptory, then these prophecies were not certain to occur in that generation. It will not do simply to claim that since these prophecies were made, they were therefore made peremptorily. This is what is at issue, and must not be decided by circular reasoning, special pleading, or emotional claims.

“It should be noted that the prophecies of the establishment of the kingdom within that present generation of Israelites to whom Christ came, were necessarily provisional. They were contingent upon Israel’s national repentance and acceptance of Jesus as the Messiah and Saviour.
It is true that it was the revealed will of God that the kingdom should then come. This is reflected in the various passages such as Matthew 24:4-34 which predicted the occurrence of certain events preceding the kingdom’s establishment within that present generation. But it is just as true that the kingdom did not then come.”

concordant.org/expositions/corre … eneration/

#13

Origen, this is a reply to your previous post. I see that you posted another immediately after. I hadn’t read that when I wrote the following:

NOPE! No uncertainty at all is expressed. The word γενηται is in the subjunctive mode (or “mood” as grammarians say, though there’s nothing moody about it). The subjective mode is used in English in the same way. For example, “I am giving this man food so that he may not starve.” The idea is that I am giving him food in order that he will not starve. The word “may” doesn’t at all suggest uncertainty. There is no suggestion in the subjunctive that the man may not starve, but on the other hand he may starve anyway. To say he may or may not starve is a DIFFERENT use of the word “may” and it is NOT a subjunctive in this sentence.

It seems that the use of subjunctives are fading from the English language and that many people don’t use them anymore. Because of this confusion of the word “may” in its subjunctive form versus its non-subjunctive use, most translations do not use the English subjunctive to avoid the confusion.

#14

Paidon, i’m not sure what you’re disagreeing with. Is it the quotes from lexicons re the Greek word AN?

#15

Origen, I may have misunderstood you, but I was reacting to these words that you wrote to Michael:

Were you not suggesting that the subjunctive mode suggests uncertainty? I was replying that it doesn’t, and that when “may” indicates uncertainty, it is not used in the subjunctive, but in a different sense.

Please pardon me if that was not your intention, and I misunderstood.