Not what I read! I read Zelensky thanking him for aid .You can read into it as Dems do , but I don’t think an election s/b overturned by reading thoughts and words into a phone conversation that about 14 other people were listening to.
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Steve, they just want to ‘get’ Trump, facts be damned. I’ve not seen anything like it.
Bob, is that statement factual or is it what you want to think was said? Could it possibly be the latter? Your defense of Biden is commendable - I don’t think! Sorry, Bob, you are avoiding the truth and going against your better judgment.
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Steve, Dave, Invernessian, and others
I find assertions that I made up this conversation to be just ad hominem assertion. My reading of what happened is based on the Trump administration’s own summary of this call, and Trump’s own words articulating what he requests, and has nothing to do with who was listening to it.
None of you answer any questions I ask about your own interpretation of the facts. You just respond ad hominem that I am a fool or a poor reader.
Since this thread has become a forum for those who support and defend Trump, and attack any critiques offered concerning his words and actions, let me ask:
Is it fine to use huge presidential power to press other nations for help in bringing down one’s own central political rival? Is it proper even in a context of blocking Congress’ voted aid to preserve Ukraine’s threatened freedom? Is saying in that context, I want you to do me that favor “though,” an apparent negotiated form of a shake down?
Is it also moral for a president to suggest that someone who has followed the law in filing a report (as affirmed by Trump’s own inspector) about apparent corruption is the kind of “traitor” who should be executed?
Although I am not a Trump supporter, I will answer. No, this is not acceptable. I also think this forum is about 50/50. Qaz, Reddit guy, Bob, Davo are left leaning. Dave, Steve, Hermano and Innver are right leaning.
I have no idea what others think I am. I think I am a bit of an anomaly, though maybe that is my wishful thinking. I react to both right and left, but do like some of their positions.
Fair enough, Bob. I’m sorry you think a few are ganging up against you, although Gabe in the above post suggests you may not be as alone as you think.
Let me ask you one question. Since Donald Trump endured a two year investigation into alleged collusion, do you agree that Joe Biden should also be investigated to uncover what his actions were with respect to his son’s involvement in Ukraine and China? Then I’ll leave this matter alone and concentrate on a much more fulfilling study of scripture and prepare sermons for the monthly sermons I give at chapel services in the seniors complex where I live.
The D’s have been wielding the big stick for 3 years now. I haven’t seen one D step up to point out their prevarications.
If voicing one’s opinion is ganging up, we’d just better all stop it.
I think some of us are trying to undo the damage from the 3 year media onslaught where ALL we heard was anti-Trump propaganda. From most here as well.
FWIW I just posted this on a different blog:
" It IS a time of war. I too feel the dissonance between a call to interior life, tenderness, deep and wide study, personal piety, deepening of faith - and concurrently, seeing the need for toughness, for pushing back constantly, for facing lies and responding, for raising the clarion call. In my small way. Frankly, in war time, the war seems to take precedence, in my mind, over everything else; mainly because if the war is lost, there will be precious little time to husband the finer tendencies of the spirit. OTOH, at 71, I’m ‘not getting any younger’ and I do not want to stand ashamed by ignoring ‘so great a salvation’ at the judgment (even though mercy will triumph) we all will face. It’s a problem."
Qaz as you know, there are hundreds of data presentations that conflict. I’m not going to bore the forum with all those. But many are along these lines. I know you will contest any and all things that I post along these lines, so I won’t bother to just list stuff.
Thanks Gabe, that was all I was asking the Trump fans. I certainly don’t see you as unbalanced or on the right (much less a Trump fanatic), and I agree that world-wide and liberal to conservative the forum is balanced. And I have no problem with investigating Biden and the ugly picture of politician’s children benefiting from their parents name and power.
But on this thread about American partisanship, the most frequent and lengthy contributors repeatedly assert that Biden is criminally impeachable and Trump must be exalted as a salvational godsend. Thus as above, I keep asking them to clarify what they actually think and based on what. And I perceive that the frequent response is crickets.
Bob, you sure know how to ‘double down’ ! 
Since I don’t think I am either frequent or lengthy, nor an American, nor was a good cricket player, I presume you do not consider me an American partisan. I am pleased that you think Biden should be investigated.
No, I don’t consider Trump a “salvational godsend”. However, you would agree, I hope, that scripture tells us that those in authority are there because God wills it. Moreover, as a Canadian citizen, I am glad to have him close by, as opposed to his predecessor, Obama.
I never said anything remotely like this, in fact I have several times said that I don’t like Trump but I like Socialism less. The overwhelmingly important issue to me is whether an election s/b overturned by Dem accusations & I think. once we get into the mode of overturning elections because we don’t like Presidential behavior this could lead to a destructive direction and lead down a pathway toward a military state.
I could give a list of Obama’s indiscretions like interfering in Israeli elections but I never considered overturning his election.
Dear friend, you are not frequent or lengthy, and I take you to nicely represent the foreign minority who finds Trump attractive, perhaps partly because his denigration of the liberal establishment reflects your own opposition to Trudeau and that kind of Canadian establishment.
I am glad that you think Obama too was there because God wills it 
And yes, I’m familiar with Roman’s 13’s expression that the authority of gov’t is God’s will. I don’t think it follows that all of the character or actions of anyone in power is necessarily seen as God’s will. John in Revelation 13 seems to portray the governing powers as so evil as to be virtually Anti-Christ. And the apostle’s response to those in power can be, “we must obey God rather than men.”
It would take about 30 Republican senators convinced of a high crime to overturn Trump’s election.
Do you seriously worry that this could happen based on “Dem accusations”?
My impression is that only one or two such senators has the chutzpah to even verbally question anything this president does or says. As my questions to you implied, they would only do that if they were deeply convinced that he has acted unconstitutionally and grievously abused his great powers in his own interests.
Did I give the impression i’m worried?
Well, if it’s your main concern, the number of times you’ve posted passionate support for Trump
did make me suspect that such a concern might have crossed your mind.
Folks are getting TOO EXCITED, about this Trump impeachment thing. Whether they are “Trump fanatics”, Democratic enthusiasts, etc.
Do something different!
The thing I learned, from the Eastern Orthodox…as well as practicing Yoga ( 1, 2); Zen (1, 2), Red Road ( 1, 2) and Light ( 1, 2, 3, 4, 5) methods - is this! Wait until the process, has reached its conclusion … Keep ahead of developments, at the BBC News and …
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Bob,
I think you are mixing me up with someone else. What i’ve repeatedly said is this impeachment issue is not about a person to me , there are bigger issues like overturning an election.
Plus i’m not worried about “Trump” because if the House impeaches him , he will get something which is very difficult for him to get on his own “sympathy.”
Plus in the Senate Mitch McConnell won’t even bring impeachment up, he will say “let the voters decide in the next election.”
It’s not even about impeachment - it’s about having lost an election, and having nothing else to offer but outrage. Against a duly elected President.
News Analysis: Trump’s Defense on Ukraine Goes Beyond Nixon’s in Watergate