The Evangelical Universalist Forum

How To Live Under An Unqualified President by John Piper

Practices Christian Living
#3960

An interesting perspective rom the Babylon Bee:

We try to stay out of politics at The Babylon Bee, as your favorite unbiased Christian news source (but sometimes Ocasio-Cortez just makes it too easy).

But we can’t hold it in any longer: in this stunning and brave editorial, our editorial board is now declaring that everyone in Washington must be removed from office.

It is clear that everyone in Washington has abused power, and it’s time for them all to resign. They have obstructed justice, abused power, and just generally wasted everybody’s time. As Christians, we must stand up and say “enough” when it’s clear that Congress, the White House, and the courts have all been complicit in theft, the murder of the unborn, and the destruction of the Constitution.

Other publications have announced that Trump should be removed from office, but they are not as virtuous as we are, because they obviously don’t care about the abuse of power that has been happening in Washington for decades. You might say this editorial is the ultimate virtue signal to end all virtue signals.

Impeach everybody. Here we stand. We can do no other. God help us.

1 Like
#3961

Now this is interesting, indeed. :crazy_face:

And on the business front. :wink:

#3962

Again a strawman, i obviously was referring to Democrat politicians and i was referring to a biblical perspective of abortion not a cultural belief that this decision is only between a women and her physician. You being a Pastor seem to oddly not have any notion that God is in the mix assuming you believe the bible.
Also who is talking about criminalizing a decision on abortion?? Where did this latest strawman come from? I certainly never mentioned or implied criminalizing abortion but something as simple as what Kentucky did which was making the mother watch a video of her fetus with all it’s human parts, effectively sways opinion. Or would you consider this an invasion of privacy?

2 Likes
#3963

60,000,000 plus more since then. Dead.

Does CT really think that is insignificant, or that Trump being boorish is somehow more egregious?
Hypocrites.

#3964

You are dodging the point. Are you seriously disputing that any of the Democrat candidates for president are “politicians”?? I think some are political hacks! :wink:

I’m struck that you staunchly agree with them on keeping abortion legal. I’m less sure that is ideal. It is arguably the crime of taking a human life.

#3965

Steve to Bob.

Perhaps he came from somewhere, far from Kansas? And the straw man is looking for substance. :crazy_face:

And I still don’t know, if he’s a Republican or a Democrat. Perhaps he is a politician? :crazy_face:

But here’s a clever politician. :crazy_face:

And I remind everyone, of the Christian HF role.

#3966

After Donald Trump proved Christianity Today’s article true with his wildly slanderous, ignorant, and angry tweet, this is CT’s clear-minded, gentle, yet firm response.

“The problem is not that we as evangelicals are associated with the Trump administration’s judicial appointments or its advocacy of life, family, and religious liberty. We are happy to celebrate the positive things the administration has accomplished. The problem is that we as evangelicals are also associated with President Trump’s rampant immorality, greed, and corruption; his divisiveness and race-baiting; his cruelty and hostility to immigrants and refugees; and more. In other words, the problem is the wholeheartedness of the embrace. It is one thing to praise his accomplishments; it is another to excuse and deny his obvious misuses of power.

Out of love for Jesus and his church, not for political partisanship or intellectual elitism, this is why we feel compelled to say that the alliance of American evangelicalism with this presidency has wrought enormous damage to Christian witness. It has alienated many of our children and grandchildren. It has harmed African American, Hispanic American, and Asian American brothers and sisters. And it has undercut the efforts of countless missionaries who labor in the far fields of the Lord. While the Trump administration may be well regarded in some countries, in many more the perception of wholesale evangelical support for the administration has made toxic the reputation of the Bride of Christ.”


Why our editor in chief spoke out against Trump, and why the conversation must continue.

About this website

I personally am miles from Christianity Today’s theology and politics, but must rejoice when any who bear Jesus’ name are able to recognize leadership that wars against many of Jesus’ central teachings.

#3967

" The past decade saw former President Barack Obama become the first chief executive of the United States to address Planned Parenthood at its annual gala and even invoke God’s blessing on the abortion business.

Obama and establishment Washington politicians also allowed millions of dollars in funding through Obamacare to be funneled to Planned Parenthood, enabling the far-left organization to launch the narrative that abortion is “health care.”

Indeed, the former president of Planned Parenthood enjoyed frequent, easy access to the White House during the last decade. As of July 2015, Cecile Richards had already made 39 visits to the White House since 2009, when she first was a guest on Obama’s inauguration day."

What ‘god’ did he invoke??

1 Like
#3968

And they will keep looking, won’t they, for the ‘good of America’ lol It’s certainly easier than doing what they were elected for. If they hurry, they can try to take the wind out of the Barr/Durham upcoming criminal investigative reports!

"The House Judiciary Committee filed a brief in an appeals court Monday that it wants former White House counsel Don McGahn to testify to determine whether more articles of impeachment are warranted against President Donald Trump.

“If McGahn’s testimony produces new evidence supporting the conclusion that President Trump committed impeachable offenses that are not covered by the Articles approved by the House, the Committee will proceed accordingly—including, if necessary, by considering whether to recommend new articles of impeachment,” the brief stated.

The committee’s counsel, Doug Letter, argued that a subpoena of McGahn, who left the White House in 2018, is still relevant despite the House having voted on two articles of impeachment against Trump—obstruction of Congress and abuse of power—last week mostly along party lines. The latest brief was filed to the D.C. Circuit Court of Appeals."

#3969

Those who only shout doom don’t recognize a cup At Least half full :slight_smile:

“We are living through the greatest improvement in human living standards in history. Extreme poverty has fallen below 10 percent of the world’s population for the first time. It was 60 percent in my adulthood. Global inequality has been plunging as Africa and Asia experience faster economic growth than Europe and North America; child mortality has fallen to record low levels; famine virtually went extinct; malaria, polio and heart disease are all in decline.”

#3970

I think this guy is onto something that both sides should ponder.

" That’s the theory. Here are Jonathan’s observation:

  • There’s a growing inability of “cultural progressives” and “cultural conservatives” to engage in dialog.
  • For a long time the “cultural progressives” had success after success. That led to the internal perception that they were not just right but also absolutely right… that only stupid hicks stood in their way.
  • Meanwhile, the “cultural conservatives” grew dissatisfied. They were pushed to the point where they had a hard time tolerating some of the things that went on.
  • Then came Brexit and Trump. Before those, progressives were absolutely convinced that they were right, that they would win, and that the future would be bright. This wasn’t just an assumption; it was a conviction… like the sun rising tomorrow morning. And then they learned that they were wrong. That was more than just an unexpected failure; it destroyed their world perception .
  • The result is widespread post-traumatic stress disorder. The progressives didn’t just lose; they were traumatized. They now experience anything not 100% on their side as being violent, hurtful, triggering. Their way to deal with this is to push more, to become more radical, to accept less compromise. They feel that everyone else is actually trying to kill them.
  • At the same time the cultural conservatives experienced something new: victory. Previously they had only lost. Still, when they see new pushes from the progressives, they remember all the times they were beaten, and they feel pushed back into a corner.
  • So, we have two groups, pushed into corners, and between them is… nothing. They are deeply polarized and don’t have anything in common anymore.
  • And the problem is… it’s the Millennials, a generation that knows they can expect nothing from the status quo. Furthermore, they lack tools for conflict resolution. Their generation is split between progressives and conservatives. And because they are neither the largest nor the most influential generation, they have no way to implement anything.
  • From this we get people on the progressive side who must radicalize, who must destroy the other side. If you look at the various progressive protests and riots, that’s exactly what you see. They are desperate, hurting, hating… and feeling righteous all the while.
  • Concurrently, the conservatives are becoming afraid. They think that if this thing on the progressive side doesn’t calm down, they’ll have to defend themselves.
  • If these movements continue, Millennial conservatives and Millennial progressives will pull out clubs and knives.
  • At the same time, the police – because of the progressive/conservative stalemate in politics – are unable to decisively take sides.
  • That’s how you start a civil war."
    https://www.freemansperspective.com/civil-war-and-the-status-quo/

I hope it does not come to that.

#3971

FWIW, CT’s Andy Crouch a cultural conservative I studied with at Regent College was prescient about Christianity Today’s current outlook on Trump (10/10/2016)

“Paul urges the Colossians to shed: “sexual immorality, impurity, lust, evil desires, and greed, which is idolatry” (3:5). This is an incredibly apt summary of Trump’s life to date. … That Trump has been, his whole adult life, an idolater of this sort, and a singularly unrepentant one, should have been clear to everyone.”

“And therefore it is completely consistent that Trump is an idolater in many other ways. He has given no evidence of humility or dependence on others, let alone on God his Maker and Judge. He wantonly celebrates strongmen and takes every opportunity to humiliate and demean the vulnerable. He shows no curiosity or capacity to learn. He is, in short, the very embodiment of what the Bible calls a fool.”

“Enthusiasm for a candidate like Trump gives our neighbors ample reason to doubt that we believe Jesus is Lord. They see that some of us are so self-interested, and so self-protective, that we will ally ourselves with someone who violates all that is sacred to us—in hope, almost certainly a vain hope given his mendacity and record of betrayal, that his rule will save us.”

#3972

Here’s an eye-opener from the BBC - just kidding! - from AmericanGreatness. But since you have already convicted Trump on your ‘hunch’, this corruption doesn’t bother you? Have you considered that he had excellent reasons to ask for the favor of an investigation, which was also begun by Obama who held up aid in actuality - except for blankets - to help Biden? BTW -

"Giuliani said that the reason the liberal establishment is fighting this so hard is because the Bidens aren’t the only ones who cashed in.

“We’ve got Democratic politicians in this country who have made a fortune—it isn’t just Joe Biden,’ Giuliani explained. “The reason they’re fighting this so hard is because a couple of their sons and husbands are taking in millions—more than millions.” He said they have the money go to family members because they don’t have to report the earnings on financial disclosure forms.

“This is monetizing public office,” the former prosecutor told Kirk."

"Rudy Giuliani alleged Monday that former Ambassador Marie Yovanovitch “quashed” a corruption investigation into the disappearance of foreign aid because the Obama Administration was funneling the money to non-governmental organizations run by left-wing billionaire George Soros.

Giuliani, President Trump’s personal attorney, recently returned from a fact-finding mission in Ukraine, and discussed his findings in an interview with Turning Point USA founder Charlie Kirk for his podcast.

The former mayor of New York City told Kirk that in 2017, the Ukrainian Accounting Authority did a study which revealed that $5.3 billion in foreign aid during the Obama/Biden years was not properly accounted for. So the agency started an investigation

“All of a sudden, members of the U.S. Embassy, under the control of Marie Yovanovitch—I call her Saint Marie Yovanovitch—comes and tells them, ‘there’s no need to do that. We’re okay with the spending. There’s no need to.’”

Giuliani said the Ukrainian Accounting Authority at first insisted that they had to conduct an investigation, but later, “somehow it came down from the top—don’t investigate.”

He said the reason the probe was quashed was because instead of giving the money to the government, the U.S. Embassy was giving it to NGOs (nonprofit organizations that operate independently of government) run by left-wing billionaire George Soros and his children.".

https://amgreatness.com/2019/12/23/giuliani-says-saint-marie-yovanovitch-quashed-ukraine-probe-into-missing-5-3-billion-in-foreign-aid/

#3973

Trump apologists use net sites claiming partisans like Giuliani pursuing riches in Ukraine are ‘proof’ that Trump is innocent, while Trump blocks them all from taking an oath about such stories, yet assure us that all of those willing to testify under threat of perjury were lying. I’d call that being a ‘true believer.’

#3974

If the Guiliani claim is true - not just another opinion, it is something that needs to be considered even more than the weight put on ‘opinions’ from “distinguished” but partisan State Department employees - since Yavonovich was at the center of this scandal.

Or should the Dems just tie up the entire country for the next 5 years? Where does it stop? When will they act for the country, not for their own political aspirations in spite of what the country wants?

#3975

That’s the most tautologous logic I’ve ever seen!
If they have any truth, let ones with info testify to it, not just claim it on a right wing Trumper site.

#3976

Wow that was quick. I didn’t read it, but you’re on a roll. I was quick too.

1 Like
#3977

Trump has a reputation for not reading too.
When you’re the smartest guy in the world, you don’t need to read what you critique! :wink:

#3978

Bob to Dave.

Well, just a few comments here.

  • Trump is a very bright guy. And he graduated from a prestigious university. But I’m sure there are many out there, that surpass him in intelligence (as measured by standard, IQ tests),

  • I’m glad to see, everyone here - is on a roll. :crazy_face:

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And sometimes we are just arriving, at the obvious. :crazy_face:

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And I look forward to more insights, from all the forum’s

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#3979

Bob, again i have no idea what you are referring to , really inexplicable? I never disputed Dem candidates are politicians and i never staunchly agreed with them on keeping abortion legal. What drug are you on?
Are leftist Bob and reasonable Bob locked in a death cage match right now??