The Evangelical Universalist Forum

Rejected by the orthodox church

Practices Church
#1

Having been a minister within the “orthodox church” for years I now am a reject. I’m curious if there are others that have been booted and how have you coped? For myself, I continue to experience deep pain at not being able to fulfill my vocation in life.

This brings up another question. Should we attempt to band together as Evangelical Universalists and form some sort of support group or even a denomination? I am well aware that many are against the idea of a localized ecclesia. This question would be primarily addressed to those that see the need to assemble. Am I the only one feeling like a man without a country these days?

#2

I now see that this topic has been discussed in detail on another thread. If the mods choose to delete this feel free to do so. As I viewed the other thread I so related to the experiences of others.

As for myself, pioneering a congregation teaching UR is the way to go. By God’s grace and help I will do so here in my hometown. All of you are welcome to join if you’re willing to move to Ky. :slight_smile: Appreciate you guys and may God’s best be yours.

Larry

#3

I forget which thread that is, but if you can copy-paste its address here then there will be a link to that thread. (Thus, people arriving at this thread can consolidate over to that one.)

Btw, which part of Kentucky are you in? (I live in West Tennessee, about 30 minutes from the southwestern KY border. In fact, I was up in Clinton, KY yesterday, about 1 hour north of here, delivering products to a customer.)

#4

I don’t think you need a specific support group, but to understand that the body of Christ is far wider than you previously thought (although I understand that you are going through the very specific pain of rejection). There are plenty of Christians who, even if they don’t preach UR from the pulpit, generally except UR as a completely valid hope, if not believe in it in a more dogmatic fashion!! I think a lot of evangelicals are very much unaware of the PCUSA, the Evangelical Lutheran Church, the Eastern Orthodox Church, and many other (very large) Christian communions to whom universalism is not anathema. If I were you, I would read WIDELY through the theologians of other churches. Think of it as your own personal ecumenical effort!

#5

I seem to have lost sight of the thread I was referring to but maybe this may suffice…
viewtopic.php?f=23&t=299

I’m about 3 hours NE of Clinton. Jason, with your vast biblical knowledge and intense spiritual hunger, why not pioneer a work there in Tennessee? For certain you could have a great influence!

While I do not believe we should dissuade others from attending the evangelical orthodox assemblies, I do believe due emphasis needs to be given to the most encouraging truth the scriptures herald. If men like yourself and others would pioneer works as this, the blinded world would behold the great God of love, and multitudes within the erring church would rise up and take notice.

As for me. I intend on sounding the trumpet loud and long. The door of opportunity has not fully opened for me, but in due time my community will hear of him who is THE SAVIOUR OF THE WORLD!

“For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe. These things command and teach.”

Larry

#6

Larry

All due respect, God does not assist anyone to spread any false doctrine, including UR. In fact, people like you who do not rightly divide the Word of God for correct doctrine…God will send chastening ( corrective discipline to your spirit, if you are truly born again) to drive you to repentance. If you continue to sear your conscience of your born again spirit with a hot iron… it will be to your destruction.

Larry, you said: For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe. These things command and teach."

Aaron37: Not only do you lift up 1Tim 4:10 out of continuity of verses 1-9, but you have put words in the Lord Jesus’ mouth that he did not say. Jesus did not say command and teach 1 Timothy 4:10 (Btw, you have grossly misinterpreted). Jesus said teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit…teaching them all things I commanded you. ( Matt 28:19-20). In other words, Jesus is telling the disciples to preach, teach and demonstrate the gospel of the kingdom of God to all the world. ( Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out devils; freely give what you have freely recieved, Matt 10:7-8) This does not include teaching the fable of obtaining salvation through the lake of fire.

My prayer is not only for you, Larry, but everyone on this discussion board who believes in or teaches any false doctrine ( including UR) to come to their senses and repent, and return to sound biblical doctrine.

Btw, this is why we have so many denominations and cults…people trying to interpret the bible with the mind of their flesh, lifting up verses individually out of continuity and making doctrine out of them. Sound familiar, Larry? Geeesh, for the love of God, do not start another denomination out of the flesh.

God bless,
Aaron

#7

Aaron,

We need your counter views to the untraditional ideas largely represented on this site! Exegetical, theological, or philosophical rejoinders that present reasons for rejecting views that you believe are false are always welcome.

But my impression is that warnings of destruction and exhortations that such folk repent are not useful in discussions on sites like this. Likewise, calling their views fables, or false doctrine, or misinterpretations, adds nothing. Others who think your own understandings are horrific would be inclined to similarly label your views and call you to repent of them. But what kind of beneficial interaction or change would that produce in you or them? Don’t you find that the usual effect of such name calling is that it hardens the other side’s bias against us, and thus we risk sharing in responsibility for solidifying them in what we find to be a serious error?

#8

Hey Bob

you said: But my impression is that warnings of destruction and exhortations that such folk repent are not useful in discussions on sites like this. Likewise, calling their views fables, or false doctrine, or misinterpretations, adds nothing

Aaron: They are useful to God, Bob. As you know, there are no grey areas with God when it comes to sound doctrine. It is true or it is false. God had Paul and the rest of the apostles correcting false doctrine throughout the new testament, and teaching the consequences of those who did not turn from their error. ( especially 2 Peter chapter 2 and the book of Jude) There are warnings in the bible about adding and taking away words to the Word of God…particularly in Rev 22:19-20. if you do this…God shall take away his part in the book of life and out of the holy city. This verse alone gives UR a huge problem since you must be recorded in the book of life or to be born again to see or enter heaven.

God bless,
Aaron

#9

Hi Aaron,

You seem wholly unresponsive to interacting with my concerns and questions about the kind of fruit your approach produces, or what is of value in the context of a forum for those with differing views. When you insist that God’s need is for you to treat people in this diverse forum with the same kind of scorn that you find the apostles calling for within the N.T. church, I find my thesis validated that most persons’ resistance is just reinforced when anyone knocks them (or even offers possible corrective considerations).

Sadly, when you suggest that since God has no grey areas, you must repeatedly call all whose interpretations differ from yours purveyors of falsehood, I am at a loss as to what kind of edifying communication we can have.

Grace be with you,
Bob

#10

Bob, Aaron is completely infallible - he’s ‘born again’. It’s a closed system and relies on repetition to ward off its enemies, which is everyone and everything - which makes anyone outside the system inferior, lost or demonic.

Strictly speaking, he CAN’T argue, he can only appeal to his own ‘born again’ infallibility. Since he is born again, whatever he believes is correct and without question, the truth.

#11

Ran

I think you know better than that…you could not be farther from the truth. Btw, since you mention about being born again… Jesus said " Unless one is born again you cannot see or enter heaven." Jn 3:3…This comes by faith in Jesus’ sacrifice for you… this comes by believing from your heart and confessing with your mouth that Jesus is your Lord and Savior and was raised from the dead…Rom 10:9-10… this does not come by being sprinkled on the head with water when you were a baby. Have you accepted Jesus Christ as your Lord and Savior, Ran? Have you received the second birth that gets your name recorded in the lambs book of life? I pray that you have.

God bless,
Aaron

#12

See? That’s what I’m talking about. If a person disagrees with you, that MUST mean they are not a Christian.

Most born-aginers grow out of it - they can’t sustain the infallibility thingie. Give it time.

#13

:laughing: :laughing:

Sonia

#14

Ran

Disagree with me, you grossly misrepresented my views and being here. Correct me if I’m wrong, Ran, but did you not tell me that you were born again by the sprinkling with water when you were a baby? I believe you did…would you please explain to me and to this discussion board how that is remotely possible…while your at it could you please show us in the Word of God where babies being sprinkled with water allows them to receive the second birth.

Ran, if you want to play paddy cake with religion…that is your choice… I don’t live by a denominational handbook of tradition, but please do not misrepresent my views or the reason why I’m here. Btw, have you accepted Jesus Christ as your personal Lord and Savior?

God bless,
Aaron

#15

Of course! I was baptized as a baby! And ‘personal’? He’s the savior of all mankind! You need to get with it. He’s not the plaything of cults, you know.

#16

Ran

Praise God! Could you please explain to us how you believe babies receive the second birth by being sprinkled with water? Could you also give us scripture references please?

God bless,
Aaron

#17

There is only one baptism for the remission of sins. It really doesn’t matter when, but don’t with-hold your children from Him.

Babies have conscientiousness of Him - witness John while still INSIDE Elizabeth. Case closed. Find another heathen. lol

#18

Ran

I will ask you one last time. I hope you will not continue to tap dance around proving the doctrine you have embraced from your denomination from the Word of God. Would you please explain to us how babies receive the second birth when they are sprinkled with water? Please give scripture references for your comments. If you have to refer to your denominational handbook to explain this…do it…and then show us references from the Word of God that supports your denominational doctrine.

God bless,
Aaron

#19

I just did. You have been soundly beaten. Deal with it.

#20

Ran

You will find nowhere in the bible anyone baptizing babies by sprinkling them with water and the result the babies being born again with the life of God inside them…Nowhere, Ran. That is not how one receives the second birth, Ran. So, why would you believe in a doctrine that is not in the Word of God?

In fact, the biblical example for us to dedicate our children to the Lord is found in Luke 2:22-24. The same way Jesus was dedicated, not by baptism, but by prayer.

God bless,
Aaron