"You must do nothing to come to Jesus" vs "This is what you must do now"


Yes we do, and we can always count on you to find the perfect song to top it all off.:grinning:

To me, it’s only common sense. If you want to live in a productive society and lead a productive life, you need to obey the Spirit of God. Otherwise, your life and land will become nothing but thorns and thistles.

Everyone who believes in Jesus’ words has cut the Levitical law out of their lives and claimed another authority.


Or maybe, you reach the top of the mountain (AKA Land of Milk and Honey)…and can listen to, “melodious” Tibetan chants…and realize, you can’t go back down - on your own. So you’re stuck!

So is that “milk and honey” or “thorns and thistles”? It all depends on your perspective! :slight_smile:


You, me and everyone else have NEVER been under OT law… such was only pertinent to OC Israel and any proselyte of the day…

Heb 9:15 And for this reason He is the Mediator of the new covenant, by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions under the first covenant, that those who are called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance.

Now you may in cavalier dismissal of the hand retort accordingly… “how do we know if the writer of Hebrews even said these words?” — to which I simply point out the same then likewise applies to your comment above about “Jesus’ words” — of which you also say the self-same thing.

You do what all religionists do… propose a problem in need of fixing and then propose the answer to said “problem”… but in the end it does nothing but reflect your own self-righteous THEM / US attitude.

What process did you go through in cutting the Levitical law out of your life :question: :lying_face:


So LLC, why all the disconnect with the old covenant? You seem to have an axe to grind… Can I ask why?


MM, I don’t believe it’s the way of God. Do you? If so, I suppose you can join the Jewish faith.:slightly_smiling_face: Not that I have anything against it now since I live in a land that believes in freedom of worship. However, if I lived in another time or place where I was forced to live by their religious laws I might have something to say about it.

According to God, no one was under the Levitical law, not even Israel.
Historically speaking however, Israel wasn’t originally under the Levitical law.

What you mention here was the way of the world; the belief that the privileged few were God’s gift to the world. They were the only ones who had the divine power and knowledge to rule.

This was not the pattern that the fathers of Israel were following. Israel was established according to another pattern as Acts 7:37-43 says. As I said before, Moses kicked the Levites out.

If you lived in the middle ages, depending on where you lived, you would have been under the law of the Roman Catholic Church. This does not mean that God put you under these laws.


So I ask again LLC… what process did you go through to cut the Levitical law out of your life :question:


I don’t follow it.

If you want to chant, far be it from me to stop you. I’m sure it’s very beautiful. However, that’s not what I’m talking about. If you say there is no Law by which men were made to operate, then you deny a Creator. We can’t just do anything we want to. Well, I suppose we can but it won’t be good for us. I don’t want to live in a place where people are running around murdering, raping, stealing, cheating, lying, selling you off as a slave, treating you as if you’re a low class nothing, throwing you in a dungeon for no reason etc. etc. etc. Would you? To me, this doesn’t fit my perspective of a land flowing with milk and honey. It would be pure hell.


Davo, I don’t understand you. You speak against religianity yet you say the Levitical law came from God. A lot of it consists of pagan ceremonies and rituals which have nothing to do with being holy. What’s up with that?


No, I don’t want to chant. Just wondering if you think, the Tibetan chants - are melodious or not. I was looking this morning, at a concealed firearm training course - at a local shooting range. Then this afternoon, I’m at a local health club. And they have the TV news stations, are talking about an active shooter in Aurora, Illinois. Several people and officers, were shot. It’s about a half hour away. So from you’re “viewpoint”, should I take that concealed training course - or not?

So my questions:

  • Just wondering if you think, the Tibetan chants - are melodious or not? You said, " I’m sure it’s very beautiful". Which tells me, you probably didn’t watch the YouTube video - for every 5 minutes. Here’s what one, YouTube - video commentator said: “sounds like I’m at a death metal concert without the band”…Just a footnote, folks. Sometimes I do certain things, to test the waters and see how people respond. :smile:

  • So from you’re “viewpoint”, should I take that concealed training course - or not?

Anyone can chime in. But as Hermano talked about spiritual protection. I wear a cross, that’s been blessed by:

  • The Eastern Orthodox and Roman Catholic churches

  • On the altars of several tribal Inipis (AKA sweat lodges)

  • Several REAL saints from the East.

But I also have no problem, with taking the concealed carry - training course. I do have an Illinois firearms card. But I don’t currently own a gun.

Trust In God But Tie Up Your Camel

For the “purists” here, I’m now watching Fox News - to follow the developments. But later, I’ll check with CBS news, the BBC News and the WFMT radio station. And there is a federal presence (i.e. FBI; ATF, etc.), involved in the investigation.


As can be seen by your own self-confessed odd beliefs above (even though you invoke the likes of ‘the royal we’ with your generic “everyone) you have in the past engaged the Levitical law in your life, and as such some of which… “consists of pagan ceremonies and rituals”, apparently.

So, I’m intrigued to know… which pagan ceremonies and rituals did you embrace in these former times, and more to my question which till now you really have dodged — HOW or by what measures did you cut said Levitical law from your life :question:

PS: perhaps Randy has some hold music while I await your answer.


Actually, LLC has a view, and the view may be well beyond most of our understanding but her view is valid and at some point we need to validate the view. I have no Idea of much of what LLC says, but she really seems to believe it. I like an alternative view. Thanks LLC.


davo, we all have odd beliefs…


Well I have asked for clarification as to the validity of some of LLC’s more audacious claims, especially as per above… so I shall await.


HF, I listened to the chants and I actually think they’re quite interesting. I like the way they made different sounds with just their voices. I also love to listen to barbershop quartets.:slightly_smiling_face:

As for your question about the training course, the decision is yours.

Thanks MM. I have to admit, I’m not a very good typist so maybe my points don’t come across very clearly.:frowning_face:

Davo, No, I’ve never followed the Levitical law. I was raised in the Christian faith. However, I could join the Jewish faith if I believed otherwise, but I don’t. Societies can change according to what people believe and so we should continue to teach our children of the same God. As for my odd beliefs, many say that the Levitical law came from Moses. I don’t believe this is the case. There are many verses that indicate otherwise, and it paints quite a different story.



Well, since you like an “alternative” view - Chad. You must enjoy my view, regarding the tribulation and Z-Hell ( 1, 2, 3). I also hope you feel…that my view is “every bit as valid”, as that of LLC! And if I’m right - then I am performing, a great service for humanity!

And this can be summed up, in two words: “Zombies bad!”


Anyway, a word must be said - regarding the Aurora, Illinois USA shooting. I was born and grew up in Aurora, Illinois. I went to school at Aurora University. I know the area well. The Aurora police department, has some of the finest detectives around. They did everything right, in preparing for a worst case scenario. Where they asked for assistance, from neighboring police departments, the Kane County sheriff’s office, the Illinois State Police, The FBI, US marshals services, the ATF, the fire department and several ambulance services. It’s a huge building - approximately 29 K square feet. And I visited the Henry Pratt website today. And they put out a great, public service announcement. They are also doing all they can, to help employees cope…and cooperating with law enforcement.

Now, back to the main topic:


Let me put it to you this way:
Christians don’t obey the words they claim come from God.
I don’t obey the words other people claim come from God.
In either case, we don’t obey Lev.law. We’ve dispensed with the words, thrown them away, cut them off, cast them out, and live according to another word.

To me, the reasons why don’t really make a difference.


Ok… so it seems, as a suspected, your earlier claim that… “Everyone who believes in Jesus’ words has cut the Levitical law out of their lives…” was on your part mere religious rhetoric designed to pad out your post, because as you’ve now made clear — you’ve never actually been under the Levitical law (which is what I already pointed out). It is impossible then to challenge or claim that any should be casting aside or cutting off that which has never existed for them; that was my whole point!


“Man shall not live by bread alone, but by EVERY WORD that comes from the mouth of God.”
If you say the Lev. law came from God then you should be living by them. I suppose if you’re not then you have cast them aside.


You just won’t own your own words will you? :roll_eyes: Like how do you even know Jesus said those words you now quote? :face_with_raised_eyebrow:


I agree, and we’ll have a fun time dealing with the idea.